Dear all,
I need to buy a second hand car for my wife to go to work and make around 400km per week.
What’s the mustachian way to buy a second hand car? This will be our second car, so your advices on insurances and taxes are welcome.
My ideas were to get a reputated brand like Toyaya that guarantees you they car is in good condition even when they are >100’000 km and the budget will depened on your advices, but no more than 10k CHF.
Thanks!
If it is only for commuting, as small as possible. Something like a Toyota Aygo, Renault Clio, Citroen C1, VW up…
Otherwise, that is a 40km round trip per working day (assuming all the days are worked), is there no other solution than car (public transport connected with bike or similar). Assuming a cost of 0.3 (cheap used car) -0.5 (what you can deduct from taxable income AFAIK) CHF/km you are looking at costs of 6-10 kCHF/a, a GA is about 3.5 kCHF/y.
Thanks! Yes the idea is to buy something cheap/small and durable.
I expect to spend around 1700 chf in diesel + 200 taxes + 200 maintanance = 2100 chf/year
How does the shraing the plate from the main car works? any benefit?
For those small cars, it will be petrol and not Diesel. With a price of 1.5 CHF/L I get around 1500 CHF/a (for 20’000 km/a). Maintenance of 200 CHF/y is way to low. Just a set of new tyres approx. every 1.5 y (about 30’000 km lifetime) costs about 360 CHF, then oil change about once a year, and your budget is already done, and no repairs done yet.
And you forgot the following (list is not exhaustive):
Plate sharing : since it is a secondary car, I do not see how that could be working (I mean if you have a first car available, use that one). Or I don’t understand the question.
200/year for maintenance sounds optimistic for an old car.
Any tips on where I could I get 4 new tires installed for 360 in Zurich? I am budgeting ~500 chf for 205/55 R16 summer tires.
What about car insurance?
200 for maintenance a year is quite low in my experience. Especially with older second hand cars (what you will get with your budget) I would say you should use at least 600 chf/year for maintenance. There’s repairs, new tyres, oil, service, etc.
Just looked up on google, was about 80 CHF (without the service of changing them of course-> I forgot that) for the cheapest. Smaller car also means smaller tyres, so all depends.
Just found an AXA page, you have to count 600-1000 CHF/10’000 km.
And don’t forget the fines! Even the most careful drivers sometimes get one in CH, and they can be steep (e.g., 250 chf for burning a red light for 0.1s).
There are cheaper tires out there, but yes putting them on costs around 100 chf on top.
My advice:
Get a car which has just passed the MFK. Otherwise you will have to count on putting more money into it too soon.
Do not pay more than 5000 francs. The loss curve flattens at the bottom end. E.g. If you buy a car for 10k, you will likely resell it in 2 years for 5k. But if you buy a car for 5k you will likely get 3k for it. A car bought for 3k will likely still sell for 2k after 2 years. There are exceptions, but that is my experience. In Switzerland you can get a good second-hand car with MFK and not too much mileage for 5k or less.
Buy from a private person. Dealers are in it to make a profit, and are more likely to pull the wool over your eyes, in my experience. I find that “typical” Swiss in particular tend to service their cars very well.
Get the smallest engine possible. Road taxes and car insurance are both based on engine size.
Consider sharing. Currently I share a Toyota Yaris with my sister. The car cost 2K with just over 100k mileage. Gas consumption, road taxes, insurance, and maintenance costs are all minimal. She uses it on weekdays to commute, I use it on weekends. Divided between us, the costs are absolutely negligible.
Thank you Daniel for your interesting reply.
I had in mind to share your recommendation. Any specific place to search for private second hand cars? I had in mind comparis.ch, any other?
Thanks
Autoscout24.ch is a must
Comparis is good, although many offers there are from dealers. I would also recommend Tutti and Anibis for offers from private individuals.
It depends, on the other hand, no decent garage would risk its reputation by selling a defective or dying vehicle knowing that the customer will be back 3 weeks later with complaints and heavy repairs.
It’s true that the best bargains are found with individuals, but knowing little about car mechanic, I’d make sure to have the vehicle checked by a professional before buying.
So my cousin that is a mechanic got angry with me when I got my second hand VW. He said that those junk cars will die at around 180-200 thousand km. And he only swears by Toyota, says Toyota Yaris (Aygo is too noisy and too slow yet not muy cheaper than Yaris). Would be the best option and will go to 300’000 km withouth problems.
Also you have to pay attention to the type of fuel you put in. Don’t buy a japanese car that use diesel and don’t buy a french car that use gasoline. Mechanic is very different from those type of engines and know-how is significantly different.
As well pay attention to the gearbox ! Automatic are more technical and are therefore more expensive in case of service. Threshold would be 2012-2015 if you buy a car older than this get a manual gearbox, else you can take an automatic.
Tires ! Some care come with 17-19 inches tires which is unusual, their supper expensive and 400km a week will get you through them quite quick ! Carefull with that too.
Then I don’t know if you are from the french speaking part or german speaking part but marketplace is also much more important. Deep into old switzerland you can find much better deals than in the french speaking part. Look at the location of the cars on the website.
Also the website you use can be considered as a marketplace per se ! I found the same cars cheaper on tutti.ch than autoscout or anibis … (partly because it is most popular on the german speaking part).
For me that’s about it …
Hope it helps,
regards
EDIT :
It depends, on the other hand, no decent garage would risk its reputation by selling a defective or dying vehicle knowing that the customer will be back 3 weeks later with complaints and heavy repairs.
Yes !
Thank you Daniel for your interesting reply.
I had in mind to share your recommendation. Any specific place to search for private second hand cars? I had in mind comparis.ch, any other?
Tutti.ch you can find good deals !
autoscout24.ch
anibis.ch
ricardo.ch
facebook market place.
- Do not pay more than 5000 francs. The loss curve flattens at the bottom end. E.g. If you buy a car for 10k, you will likely resell it in 2 years for 5k. But if you buy a car for 5k you will likely get 3k for it. A car bought for 3k will likely still sell for 2k after 2 years. There are exceptions, but that is my experience. In Switzerland you can get a good second-hand car with MFK and not too much mileage for 5k or less.
Yes ! (maybe 6k 2nd hand market is high now)
Also they say that the best value cars are 3 years old cars, almost new but half the value … I don’t share this opinion I still find them too expensive but you are almost guaranteed to keep them years !
- Get the smallest engine possible. Road taxes and car insurance are both based on engine size.
True ! I wouldn’t go under 80 horse power though, not confortable when you carry people and material through vineyards ! If you only do city and flat alright.
A friend of mine is budgeting CHF 500 p.a. 
Thanks you all!
what about the electric vehicle option? shall it be rejected for this business case?
Any way buying an electric car will compensate the innitial down payment?
Thanks
Electric car are quite expensive so it’s no really mustachian lol
On the more you have to consider that switching the batery of an EV costs around 10k CHF (for the cheapers).
Lets be honest changing the battery each 100’000km is still much cheaper than gas for the same distance. Therefore I would say it’s all about depreciation !
Let’s put it in a financial exemple. I would say that fixed costs (value of the vehicle, battery, insurance) are higher for an EV but variable costs are much lower (price per km). So to depreciate it properly the more you use it the quicker you will profit from it vs a gas vehicle. Typically a taxi or someone that drives a lot in town like an pizza delivery guy would benefit a lot from an EV.
What are your toughts ?
If you are looking to get a new car in the CHF 50-100k price range, then you could include EVs as an option. Otherwise leave them be for the time being. EVs are a new and rapidly-changing market, and there is not yet enough data on the life spans of batteries, resale value, and other variables to accurately predict the costs. For those who really want an EV, I would personally recommend leasing or long term rentals/car plans for now. Those options have higher costs, but at least you know what you’ll pay. I certainly wouldn’t consider EVs to be a mustachian option just yet, when you can pick up a good, economical petrol car for a few thousand francs.