When I switched from Raiffeisen to Neon the time needed was negligible. E-Bill you just have to enable as @Cortana wrote. Then I had one LSV which I had to change and I needed to inform my employer.
That’s all I did, I didn’t keep the old account. I didn’t have any issues.
It’s been a while since I ran the numbers last time, but it checks out for us.
We use the UBS credit card for everything domestic. We don’t miss a single opportunity to collect points: Buy a loaf of bread at the local baker, pay a couple francs for the parking lot, pay the mobile phone subscription, everything. And it’s comfortable, with Apple Pay even more so. Then, once in a year, my gf transfers her KeyClub points to me and I pay the package.
Only if you’re forced to visit me in order to live in the actual society, and I can take one of your kidneys, keep it and lend it to other people at a 0.8 - 9% interest rate whenever I want.
It might be over-optimisation…I admit that I won’t be ruined by paying 2CHF/month for my bank account.
But why do so while I can - possibly, hence the topic - have the same service for free? We are, after all, in a frugal,mustachian forum…
About the cost-opportunity : I basically use my bank account as an emergency-fund and a cash-cushion, so it served both the use of my financial safety and making my bank account free of charge.
Do doctors offer loss-leading services, because “Hey, I’ll treat you for free, cause I can make money on other patients? Or from the kickbacks I’ll receive for meds from Big Pharma” ? :
yes we do, lots of treatments or follow-up regimens aren’t at all cost-effective and they are not the best “financially speaking” for the doctor either. But it is done anyways because money is not the most important aspect of health (at least until recently…)
If you do know how a bank can get 3-5% returns on consumer deposit, I’d encourage you to start one (it would be extremely successful given the amount of cash people would love to put in a bank with no negative interests).
Banks lose money on deposits at the moment (and try to recover it through banking fees and now negative interests). Banks get money on the financial products they sell you (funds, etc.), not on the deposits.
They dropped below 5% by now, which is quite astonishing historically (though I guess they still earn a hefty 3% on those).
Also I had a quick look into BCVs report: They actually still earn 0.3% per year on retail deposits, which is quite good in today’s environment.
And to add on the topic regarding Raiffeisen: They also offer a free account card, with which you can use their ATMs for free (no need to pay for a debit card, but doesn’t work for payments or other ATMs).
@nabalzbhf wrote it right: if it is free, you are the product.
To be on topic: open a private account with Zürcher Kantonalbank (one of the fewer banks with an AAA rating) for CHF 1.- per month (savings account not needed). Use it as a main account. There is a real bank behind with ATMs and several branches.
Open a second account with CS (e.g. CSX) and use it as operational account. Another real bank behind with even more ATMs across Switzerland and branches (e.g. best, if you are not living in Zurich).
I personally use this combo, if one e-banking/app should not work once but I have to do urgent stuff.
The credit cards I use are from Swisscard AECS - I do not use debit cards since they make no sense in my eyes.
They have also CC with Cashback function. If you are covering your recurring expenses (e.g. mobile/internet membership, SBB, food/drinks at Migros/Coop/you name it, etc etc.) then you will even have a positive return (0.2-1% on your expenses, depending on which card you are using) and cover your CHF 24 with BCV or CHF 12 with ZKB easily.
Optimization is a good thing - that‘s why we are here with the same mindset. But sometimes there is no added value with overoptimization and it even gets more complex.
Well, it requires a small cognitive leap, but Patron explained it quite well, so I probably don’t need to say anything more.
But you are forced by the society to give me 100 CHF, I lend it to another person for a 3%(yr and in exchange I keep it safe four you, we could infer that I am already making money with your money.
Maybe I can’t formally say you’re paying me, but close enough, as far as I can consider
This is missing the part about banking regulation, which ensures that deposits are not at risk. You can’t do that 1:1 between deposit and loans, for each loan you have to take into account the risk, which makes the margin much much slimmer. Don’t forget that a bank can’t just “store” cash, every night the sheet is balanced, whatever extra capital/deposit it has needs to go somewhere safe (which by default is short term sovereign or central bank deposit with negative rate).
I’m not sure what you want, they already subsidize deposit quite a lot, do you want them to be forced by the government to subsidize it further? Like X% of other product revenue should be used to subsidize retail? Do you know any company that decides to keep losing money on a product because overall they’re still profitable? I wonder if instead we could use something like taxes to redistribute wealth
There’s quite some competition and they’re all folding one after the other and lowering the threshold for negative interest because they can only have so much of a loss leading product.
(and there’s a feedback loop, as more bank do it, the remaining ones end up with more deposit, which cost more money so they’re forced to introduce fees, etc.)
I like what one columnist from cash.ch was saying: that banks pay themselves nice boni when things are going well, and when things are going bad, banks have to be saved with public administration money. So, where are your emergency funds?
I am curious, what do people think banks can invest money into at 5%?
Last I checked the market rate for a variable mortgage is about 0.6%
5% suggests equities or unsecured lending neither of which I would want my bank to be investing very much into, I am no expert on capital requirements but I am sure its not allowed
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