Postfinance increases fees for Giro


#1

breaking news :wink:


Postfinance raises fees for private accounts to CHF 5 per month, unless some conditions that involve investing 25kCHF.
What are your choices of a private account?

get some inspiration here
https://www.moneyland.ch/en/privateAccount/list


#2

Not that it was ever really free to have an account with them - you had to lock up 7.5k and swallow the opportunity costs


#3

of course that’s really important to all those that have an emergency fund of less than 7.5k :D, but i strongly expect everyone here to have abit more^^


#4

Not so sure about that, there’s generous (and expensive) unemployment insurance as your safety net here and personally I also have some credit cards with generous 15k credit line in total, for free


#5

I saw this this morning. I’m already planning on transferring all my PF Money to Migros bank. Although, I would prefer to not have the 7500 limit on there.


#6

Alright, but emergency funds aside, it’s not a bad idea to have at least 10% in fixed income investments, and since bonds seem so bad right now, then we’ve established that CHF cash is a good alternative.

I don’t think it’s fair to say: „what, you have 7500 at PF at all times, you lose 7% of that each year! That’s like 500 CHF”. I think being 100% in stocks and relying on credit card debt for emergencies is a bit aggresive.

@hedgehog and what is your bank of choice if not PF?


#7

Probably will stay with PF, it’s chump change to me, almost all other banks already charge about similar fees. Especially if you need extra accounts, euro, dollars. I wouldn’t count on migros staying free for too long, and btw notice that they have a fee for incoming payments


#8

I’m torn on this. I practically never use the postfinance card of my account. But I cannot not have it, while other bank may charge separately for account and maestro card. So I may switch and not take any maestro card.

If you have 25k invested in any fund you skip the cost as well, but since their etrading cost 90 p a and their mutual funds have all like 0.7-1.5% TER your are better off just paying 60 chf p a

I’ll need to think about this :wink:


#9

I think it’s important to mention what you could have with PF for free if you invest 25k (or 25k in 3a as well? not sure)

  • Free accounts in EUR/USD etc. with cards
  • ATM withdrawal worldwide for free (apart Thailand and other contries that taxes foreign cards)
  • ATM withdrawal for free in Switzerland at any ATM
  • did I miss something?

Also a small note to put something in perspective: The paper statements costs 1chf each. That’s almost the same cost you have with other banks, since they usually make you pay the postage (0.85cts)

I still have to check, but the other good offer I know is Raiffeisen, but only if you are a member. They will start to charge 40chf/year for their maestro/visa card starting 2019 as well. You get also free entry in many many museum around switzerland as well (If you like to go to museums regularly, this should be a good investments, having seen the costs of swiss mueums…)


#10

in sucky funds

migros, that was already mentioned, currently doesn’t and account maintenance is also for free

But not for long I’d guess


#11

I didn’t know Migros now have two different bank accounts and one have the card free.
https://www.migrosbank.ch/de/privatpersonen/konto-und-karte/maestrokarte.html

The downside is that you can withdraw only at Migros for free…

I forgot to mention that SEPA transfer for postfinance are Free.
Also postfinance add a Phishing insurance up to 100.000chf.


#12

Hi hedgehog you mentioned your 15k credit card as emergency fund. But some emergency may not be payable with credit cards (like unexpected dental operation). Do you plan to withdraw cash from an atm with your credit card? Doesn’t it cost a fortune?


#13

I’m yet to see any doctor here who would demand cash right away rather than sneakily sending a bill weeks to months later, usually with standard 30 days terms. Also I can just withdraw cash from my CCs for a small fee and draconian interest, but it’s fine until next payday.


#14

so what if it’s for free, when it’s at a criminal exchange rate?

Seriously, why are you so fixed on withdrawals? Just learn to use a credit card. I guess I make only one withdrawal per year, and these few hundred CHF are enough to cover my cash expenses for a year.

Let’s not forget the great comparison tool from Moneyland, where you can type in how often you want to use what services and it will calculate the total cost of a private account or a banking package, if you also need a credit card. I strongly recommend to calculate for 10 years, as some banks offer a discount for the first year.

As for credit cards, I use the Cumulus. With 2000-3000 spent each month, I get around 100 CHF in coupons, So they actually pay me to use the card. It still puzzles me how it makes a business sense.


#15

I don’t like to be tracked. That’s why I prefer cash. About withdrawal abroad, you are right. I don’t use it anymore that way. I do use my PF EUR though. No exchange fees, other than the MF that see the origin of the card (swiss) and not their currency (if you fall for that, your EUR will first exchanged to CHF from PF and then back to EUR from the thieves).

Moneyland isn’t always trustworty. They suggest CreditSuisse forgetting how much it will cost you their whole package…

I might starting using a CC sooner or later… it seems that I’m tracked anyway :frowning:


#16

I’m with UBS and I have all cards (debit and credit, for me and my wife) as well as all account keeping costs covered with Keyclub points which I get in return for paying with a credit card.
Of course I only pay for domestic purchases as the card is very expensive whenever currency exchange is involved.


#17

After being a PostFinance client for a few years these charges make me angry - mostly because I learnt about them by chance, and PF so far haven’t informed me about the changes to come in 2019.

I started setting up a Cler Zak account (I can use Revolut and TW for withdrawals anyway), but they seem to have a problem with double tax residence (Polish tax residency is quite difficult to get rid off :wink: but comes with some benefits) - I got a msg to contact them by e-mail to proceed.

Anybody here had a similar problem with Cler Zak?


Polish-Swiss Tax residency
#18

And when they dropped interest rates from 0.8% to 0% that didn’t make you angry? It’s the same thing mathematically (-60/7500=-0.8%), it’s just your loss aversion talking now


#19

I am customer at pf and at ca nextbank but i’ll probably close my pf account and move everything to ca

  • maestro is chf 30 or 40 but not per year only every time you get a new one
  • no monthly fee, no atm fee, no ebanking payment fee
  • they also have a 20k minimum cash you need to benefit, you get more benefits with a ‘pack’ with at least 30k in your accounts. Pretty complicated. read the fee pdf you find here:
    https://www.ca-nextbank.ch/de/de/bankkonten-und-karten/chf-lohnkonto-essenciel-im-detail.html
  • savings account yields 0.5%. Not a lot but you wont get more anywhere at the moment.

No extra cost if you live abroad. Not interesting for me, but some readers may want to retire in italy, poland etc


#20

CA option looks nice, but it’s 0.2% on a traditional saving account.
0.5% option only for freezing the money for 24 months (2% penalty in case of early withdrawal)