The other day we were discussing Charlie Munger’s passing. Believe it or not, the biggest lesson I took from him was neither an investing nor financial one. See for yourself:
So yes, bad sh*t happens. But life goes on and I’ll find a way.
I agree for extreme activities. But if I took a lesson from this injury, that’s that I should work out a lot more my core and back muscles to compensate for my office physical inactivities, or my old days will be ugly.
A big part of my physical reeducation was done with pilates, coached by my physiotherapist. During the sessions, most of the participants are people over 50. I took two lessons from that:
It’s not normal that i have these issues much younger than the average person and therefore I should take care a lot more of my physical fitness, especially as a keyboard slug.
It looks like back injuries are very common in older people (over 50). I should prevent that, because that’s not fun at all. Refraining from extreme sport is one mean of doing that. But still, entropy will find a way, therefore I should work out to have a fit back.
Well to be honest, I think that for most people figuring out the basics should be enough. Spend less than you earn, invest the difference, try to increase your revenue, move on to something else. Low-cost index funds on a global index is good enough for most people. So I am also kind of surprised that the average participant on the forum stays active a lot more than 1-2 months. I guess that’s a good thing for the forum, but maybe not such a good thing for the average participant, who might be way over-optimizing his personal finances…
EDIT: Sorry, hadn’t seen julianek’s post yet when writing this
How’s that related to their salaries or the white collaredness of their jobs? At least they don’t depend much on their physical body to do their work - and can still work (relatively) well with a broken leg or rib - contrary to, say, a builder. And shouldn’t these office workers more than anyone else keep being physically active in their free time, to compensate for the lack of it in the workplace?
I’d argue the success (to financial independence) lies more in having or developing “healthy” financial habits (the “basics”) than in optimising and tracking one’s spend in great detail, switching to (often more “exotic”) investment vehicles to eke out a fraction of a percent etc. There’s a tendency to overoptimise.
I sometimes feel it would be interesting to track my net worth. But in the end, whether I do it through a Beancount or Portfolio Performance, it’d be more of an interesting hobby to have. The - considerable - work I’d have to put into it won’t take me much further on my path - and may be spent more wisely elsewhere (education).
We all have to do our yearly tax returns anyway. I can just take the figure from the Wertschriftenverzeichnis, add the balance of my 2nd pillar and pillar 3a (and the worth of the house/apartment and its mortgage, had I bought one) to get a good, yearly indication of my net worth. In literally five minutes, on the back of an envelope. Do I need more? Not really.
A huge loss for sure. What stuck in my mind was this sentence from his last interview:
I’m not all that pleased. I basically screwed up. I could have done a lot better if I had been a little smarter, a little quicker. I might have had multiple trillions instead of multiple billions. I do think about what I missed by being just not quite smart enough or hardworking enough.
You know how people ironically use to say that nobody on their deathbed says “I wish I worked more”. And here’s 99-old Charlie, who grinded till his death, regretting that he could’ve done so much better. Wow…
Absolutely. I recently signed up to a gym to combat muscle atrophy. Let’s see how it goes. Covid and home office made me really weak. Sometimes I get dizzy from just sitting for too long…
Well, I think 1-2 months is too short for most to get in the right mindset. And there are certain things you can argue about (how frugal should you be, how passive should your portfolio be, real estate good or not, countless tax optimisations, life hacks). But at some point it becomes too much.
With high salary you can afford to pay someone to carry the heavy stuff for you. With an office job you’re usually not fit enough, unless you work out a lot after work. My dad always wanted to do everything himself, like climbing on a ladder 10m high, to clear out leaves from the gutter. It’s nice to be self-dependent, but is it worth risking to hurt yourself?
I’ve been lurking over this forum for the past couple of days.
Mainly to strengthen my limited view of the finance world with some Swiss delicacies.
Have skimmed through your blog, and was struck by how similar our circumstances are.
We’ve moved to CH this summer, having two similarly aged kids, and our boy having similar issues to yours, tho we haven’t had any diagnosis, I do think that these views are often suffering from a strong confirmation bias.
I’m working in big tech. I’d say money-wise, yes. You might be missing out, sanity-wise, absolutely not.
Obviously, it highly, highly, highly depends on the team you get into, and what would you be seeking at one of these exactly, but it might not be what you expect.
For sure, it is not what I was expecting. I was looking for inspiration, I was looking for people whom I could easily respect for a facet of their personality, smarts. What I got in return was a lot of meaningless ‘wanting to be relevant’, being aggressive selling BS. Ofc, you get this at most companies, but in the back of your mind, you’d want highly thought-of companies to be different.
Joining my thoughts regarding @Julianek’s family and injury situation, adding also my thanks like many people here for the deep and meaningful contributions you have made and are making. You do bring us food for thought that allows us to become better and that is highly appreciated.
I would say hiring outside help to do things that need to be done makes a lot of sense past certain salaries, assuming you don’t specifically enjoy doing those things yourself.
I would however say that I find my productivity increasing and my mind clearer when I do work out and go out in nature rather than when I don’t. Sure, I can select lower risk hikes instead of going ski touring, and I can do tai-chi instead of powerlifting but I do think maintaining a level of activity and doing so in something we enjoy has beneficial effects for most people, and more productive people are able to have more impact with it than less productive people can.
I would say the equilibrium is somewhere between staying fully away from activities with a higher risk of injury and voluntarily exposing themselves to heavy injuries for them.
It’s funny to read this. Currently confined to bed with acute lumbar pain, I realize the paramount importance of preserving both one’s body and mind. I recall my economics classes, particularly the concept of opportunity cost, which seems crucial, especially in personal finance where it’s impossible to know and master everything.
To free up my mind and ensure peace in my choices, I ponder the value added and opportunity cost. Why undertake something (like pruning my trees) if someone more experienced can do it more efficiently? What do I gain, beyond the financial aspect? How could I use that time differently?
Ultimately, it boils down to delegation. Although it comes at a cost (labor, machinery, etc.), I liberate a significant amount of time to focus on myself, my mental well-being, and my physical health. In my early thirties and dealing with back problems, I don’t have the desire to know and master everything as my father did, whose physical and mental health were significantly impacted.
Freeing up time for the essential, safeguarding mental health from daily stress, and improving physical fitness should be absolute priorities.
Now for you, @Julianek, I wish you all the best and the necessary courage to face the challenges you’re going through. As an esteemed member of the forum, your posts consistently provide an insightful perspective and exemplary kindness.
Absolutely, it’s true for me too. I tend to just sit at the PC for hours, focused on work, and I experience brain fog, problems with concentration. Exercise and movement is the only cure in these situations. I’m not sure why you said “however”, as it doesn’t negate what I said . I’m just saying please avoid unnecessary risks, if possible, especially if you only do this to be frugal, or more self-sustainable.
Ok maybe i did not got the causal relationships correctly, anyway here is how it went for us:
Summer 2022, at Kinderspital : “Sorry, although your son has a biological age of 4yo, he only has cognitive and motor skills of a 2yo.”
Summer 2023, again at Kinderspital: “Your son is officially diagnosed with autism spectrum disorder”
October 2023, at the genetic center: "Your son has a mutation on the BRSK2 gene(*). There are only 19 cases known/documented in the world and all of them present similar symptoms."
From a purely FIRE perspective, the main impact has not been financial. Sure, between 2022 and 2023 (at the time when we did not know where his problems were coming from), we spent a lot of money on therapies that in hindsight could have been avoided. But now that we had the autism and genetic diagnosis, I have been pleasantly surprised how the Swiss system took this over:
The Heilpädagogin coordinated with the Schulpsychologin and he got assigned to an integrated Kindergarten (i.e healthy children mixed with children with special needs), where a lot of specialized persons can take care of him (in addition of the main teacher, there is roughly one additional person per kid with special needs). As a result he feels very well at school (which is a big relief, we were worried about how he would integrate in school. Kids can be very mean sometimes).
Because the special school is a bit far from home, Kanton Zürich is providing a taxi service that fetches him everyday and drives him to school in the morning and brings him back at noon (this is much appreciated and a serious time-saver)
Because of his disability, he is now considered invalid by the AHV, and a lady from the AHV invalidity insurance came to us to assess him to review if he will need a disability pension until he is 16. We’ll see how it goes.
But as said, the main FIRE question is not financial. The main aspect is how to build a happy and purposeful life for him in a world where he will never be like the others and probably never be able to get a job. We’re lucky that in spite of his disability he is a happy child (and also his autism is on the quiet side, not the perpetual-tantrum-throwing side). So even if when interacting with him you can instantly feel that something is off, he is a pleasant kid to be around. But the fact is that he won’t be a child forever and the question of building a purposeful life in spite of mental disability is not an easy one.
Time-wise, i am shared between two approaches:
the sprint approach: increase my revenues as much as possible to accelerate FI and stop working in 3-4 years to spend time as much time with family as possible
the coasting approach: reduce working time now to 60-80% and spend more time with family. Even if the weekly work quantity will be reduced, the overal timespan of working time will get longer and FI will be postpone, so I will need to find a long-term job that is more meaningful…
(*) For the more biology-minded people among you, this gene has several important roles in the brain:
Neuronal Polarization: BRSK2 is involved in the development and maintenance of neuronal polarity. Neuronal polarity is crucial for the proper functioning of neurons, as it determines the direction of nerve impulse transmission.
Synapse Formation and Function: It also plays a role in synapse formation and synaptic plasticity. This is critical for learning and memory, as synaptic plasticity is the process by which the strength of connections between neurons changes.
Neuronal Differentiation and Maturation: The gene is implicated in the differentiation and maturation of neurons. This means it helps in the development of neurons from precursor cells and in their subsequent maturation.
Neuroprotection: Some studies suggest that BRSK2 might have a role in neuroprotective mechanisms, helping to safeguard neurons from damage under stress or in neurodegenerative diseases.
Cell Cycle Regulation: In the broader context, BRSK2 is involved in cell cycle regulation, which is critical in the brain for the controlled division and specialization of cells.
Sorry for the late answer. The “however” was a reaction from your previous statement:
It seemed more broad to me than just physical labor and my understanding was that it could also cover hobbies, activities we enjoy and potentially strenuous body maintenance (lifting, for example). I think it’s a case by case basis and that having a (highly productive - in parentheses because optional) office job doesn’t mean that we should avoid strenuous physical activity.
Of course, you know that France is a big country and you can go to places that are better or worse. It might be worth exploring the different options rather than, say, just your home town.
Hi Julianek, you’re a smart guy I found this thread by email digest, but I’m glad I’ve skimmed through it. You are right, stocks and other instruments are just numbers to me. That’s why I am able to make only low but safe gain. My new year’s resolution is to get smarter this year, hahah. I’ve reached a point of career with a straight path to FIRE so I’m no longer interested in spending every moment to gain professional knowledge, instead I plan to devote my time to get smarter financially from now on. I can save now 100k+ per year, so I just keep fingers crossed this is my last job. If it happens sooner than I’d expect I hope to be prepared to FIRE with what I’ll have by then.
Regarding Poland, my mother land, you’ve made a serious mistake not doing any research about the country. Cracow and the whole south of Poland is the worst place live. If you’d ever consider it again, definitely try the north or middle. I lived in many places of Poland, if I move there again I guess I’ll settle around Poznan. Big city life is not what I’m looking for, but being close to one, like Zurich, has many benefits. IMO Poznan located in the middle between Warsaw and Berlin offers the best economic potential.
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I found this thread by email digest, but I’m glad I’ve skimmed through it. You are right, stocks and other instruments are just numbers to me. That’s why I am able to make only low but safe gain. My new year’s resolution is to get smarter this year, hahah. I’ve reached a point of career with a straight path to FIRE so I’m no longer interested in spending every moment to gain professional knowledge, instead I plan to devote my time to get smarter financially from now on. I can save now 100k+ per year, so I just keep fingers crossed this is my last job. If it happens sooner than I’d expect I hope to be prepared to FIRE with what I’ll have by then.