Financial awareness in the society

Did you do that on google sheets? how?

Nah, in Excel. Chart type X Y and then chose the dark theme from the presets.

Last week I talked to a friend of mine… and was reminded of this thread.

  • He married in his mid 20s,
  • fathered two children,
  • separated from his wife in his mid 30s,
  • but did not file for a divorce,
  • and he’s about 45 now.

They’ve both been dating other people over the years, but neither have entered stable relationships yet. At least that’s what he thinks of his wife, he doesn’t really know what her love life is. He says he’ll ask for a divorce once he’s found a new partner.

He says they are still married “for financial reasons, they save so much taxes like this”. Yes, he knows he’ll have to give her half of his 2nd pillar, so “longterm this might not make sense”.

He had absolutely no idea what “give her half of his 2nd pillar” actually meant. He didn’t know how much his was to expect neither from the 1st pillar, nor from the 2nd. He doesn’t have a 3a.

I told him to find somebody to run some numbers for him. – “Ah, yeah, maybe, when I get around to it…”

I told him that for all we know, she did exactly that and that’s why she isn’t filing for a divorce. – “Oh, you think so, hmm maybe I should really look into this…”

And then I decided it was better to change the topic…

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What the hell. I don’t want to know how much this will cost him.

Are they at least officially separated? This date is relevant.

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…and vice versa.

Who says he’s not going to benefit?

The assumption is just plausible and probable.

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I forgot to add that he earns at least twice as much as she does.

He moved out only a few years ago.

EDIT: Come to think of it, how much of an influence does this have? Is this taken into consideration in some way?

As a lawyer: YES.

For divorces you have two paths: joint request for divorce OR action in divorce.

The first one is basicaly an agreement between the future ex-spouses who agree on several points for their future. For example, they can decide to not split the 2nd pilar and to not split their savings (3a, bank account, etc.). But, as it is an agreement, both of them need to agree on EVERYTHING they want to set up in this agreement. It works fine if the spouse are in a good relation, it happens more than you can imagine, fortunately.

The second option is the typical divorce where everyone will lose something and destroy the other. But for an action of divorce, you need to have at least 2 complete years of seperation, this is why the separated date is truly important.

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I am a subscriber of NZZ and they recently carried a few articles that talked about the rising prices of real estate in Switzerland.

More than once they have written that one of the major reasons for the increase of real estate prices is that savings accounts have little, if any, interest rates. And so, according to NZZ, people are moving from savings accounts to real estate. They also continue to write that living in a property is so much cheaper than renting.

And this brings me back to this thread here.

Do they really believe that people have hundreds of thousands of francs in saving accounts and then say “oh you know what, rates are so low, I’m gonna get myself a house now”? Or is it what people really do? And why don’t they seem to know the concept of opportunity costs?

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Many people don’t want to think about investment, and if they don’t spend beyond their means they will end up with x00k CHF in their bank account. At this point the bank will apply a lot of pressure for them to invest it (funds or mortgage, for many people real estate will sound safer than funds).

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Yes, it is, in fewer than 20 characters!

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I guess some people indeed do that. I have a close friend in that exact situation : good revenue, education, works in IT mostly for banks. He’s been stacking money for years in his account (>100k by now), never did anything with it. He know that’s ‘bad’ but for some reason (laziness, lack of interest in the subject, both ?) doesn’t do anything about it, despite knowing that I’m more knowledgeable in that field than most people and I’d happily share information with him along with some material to get started.

Then recently, he decided to try and do something with it. I’ll let you guess what’s his plan :smiley:

lots of people (maybe only in my circle, but I don’t think so) think that investing(Action, crypto, …) is evil. It is just a game for banks and very wealthy people, and cause more harms than good. Investing in housing is more ethic and not considered as properly investing.

except for Gamestop :slight_smile:

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An article in the NZZ write for people that might read the NZZ about …people that might read the NZZ.
Definitely not the whole swiss population. So all the annecdata you all say are as fine as the article.
But not valid for the whole CH

It reminds me of this:

What’s your point with the tweet?
They usually don’t list the savings in those graphs.
Considering this, he’s spending the money quite wisely.
(Just checked the article, he has $43k saved at age 25. Seems pretty good to me.)

The point is the same as the NZZ Article. They write about a speicific subgroup of people rather who their believe they write about. (Or in some cases they just pretend to know. 20usd internet per month?)
The biggest example, as pointend around some internet forums, is the 600+ donation. It 's probably someone who “donate” every month to the church (I don’t know how it’s called that kind of tax)

Bad example:

Philanthropy is a key part of Klee’s financial picture. Each month, he donates a significant amount, around $615, to a variety of charities, including More Than Words and GiveDirectly. The bulk of his contributions go to One Family, a non-profit located in Waltham, Massachusetts, that works to end homelessness and break the cycle of poverty for local families.
“I spend money that I would otherwise spend on going out, or just putting it in savings,” he says.
It’s a worthwhile expense for Klee because, while “it’s not a significant amount of money for me,” it makes a difference for others. “It doesn’t affect my quality of life at all, and yet I’m able to actually alleviate a lot of suffering and make a lot of people’s lives better,” he says.

Seems he just cares about things other than getting to financial independence and that’s cool.

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Ok got it.
I wanted to link it to the NZZ article since it seems that NZZ is generalizing something that’s not really general.

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ditto. I try to explain in every way I can but some won’t even believe me about the problems 3ieme investments mixed with risk insurances…they’d prefer not admit that they’d already lost money and don’t want to have to call the insurance to get out of it…so forget about talking about FinPension or VIAC.

FIRE Fund is a whole other story, won’t even let me start to explain how I invest …and i only have 1 fund!

16 posts were split to a new topic: [COFFEE] Investments and donations