My understanding of the land area -
Plot 1 for House 1 (23a) - 175m2 + 93m2 from the common area = 268m2
Plot 2 for House 2 (23b) - 230m2 + 37m2 from the common area = 267m2
However, the advertised land area (Grundstücksfläche) for house 23b is 295m2 (presumably 230m2 for house 23b + half of the common area - 65m2)
That is slightly above 10% extra advertised than the actual land area!
Few things that are red flags for me -
Incorrect values for the Grundstücksfläche most probably to artificially increase the house value - does not seem to be an oversight to me.
Each house has 2 carports (total 4 parking slots) in the common area. The agent’s valuation has a value of 90k for the 2 carports for house 2. So, he is selling me the land and then charging me additional money for the carports on my own land! Again, this looks fishy to me.
The top floor of the house has a slanted roof. What is the required height of the roof from where it would be counted as living space? I have heard different numbers starting from 1m to 1.5m.
Any inputs from the forum would be highly appreciated; do correct me if my understanding on point 1 and 2 above is not correct.
I have not yet discussed this with the agent, but he has now put me in touch with the owner (the person who has constructed the houses) with whom I will have a discussion soon.
Thank you!
P.S. Price details - the 2 banks I have contacted have given the middle value in the same range (1.45Mn) against the asking price of 1.69Mn. Both banks use the valuation from Wuest & Partner.
On the other hand, the agent has also done his own valuation using the same tool that values the house at the asking price - he has considered the land area as 295m2 as input criteria and 90k for the carports.
Accounting for the correction of the land area and the carports, the value is in the same range as the bank’s valuation.
I would obviously not overpay by such a margin if the owner sticks to the asking price and the discussion might just be academic. But, better to have the right knowledge/understanding.
Counting something for the carports might make sense as the carports themselves should be included and not only the land. 45k per parking space seems pretty high (though it would depend on the type of carports), it is possible/likely that the price of the land is included (I’d compare with the value for the land they should have provided to you to be sure), in which case, they might indeed be double billing for it.
I don’t have a definitive answer. It might vary from a municipality to the other, I’d check if there’s something about it in the local building code (should be available on the website of the municipality and can be asked from the municipality if not available. A phone call to the construction office of the municipality should also allow to answer that question).
The seller can say whatever he wants. He can say, he’s adding 100k to the price because his now deceased friend spent his last day there and it has a lot of sentimental value.
In the end, he asks for a price and you will offer a price and it comes down to whether you agree on a number. How each of you get to that number is irrelevant.
I’m sure we’ve found the same websites; wooden carports shouldn’t exceed 15k/car space (and could be way less). For example (in French because my search-fu is better in it):
For the academic purpose: Could it be possible that the 37/130 split is either based on the upper part of the co-owned area directly next to the blue plot, and / or to make both new plots equal in size? For simplicity, regulatory or tax reasons?
And the one used to advertise is based on the right of usage? Meaning on paper, the left part on paper is owned by house A, but you have unlimited usage of half of it for your parking?
If that’s the case, another way to look at it is that you don’t pay the seller for the parking, but the owner of house A.
The price for the car port could simply be a standard value for some valuations.
I wouldn’t call these red flags. You can clarify it with the agent or seller and share the result with us. These «market values» are just tools to get a ball park figure, not sure how much they take details like rights of use into account.
Regarding the living space, there’s a SIA norm (416?) which refers to 1.5m. If I remember correctly, it doesn’t use the term living space, but main and secondary usage. Other models count such an area under 1 or 1.5m by 50% or not at all.
There’s no mandatory use for SIA norms. You can look up or ask based on what standard has been calculated.
Is the house already build? Or would you buy it based on the planned?
The structure for this house is concrete with provision for electric charging. Still, 45k for 1 carport seems quite high, especially as the land for the carport is included in the price.
It does. Chances are they’ve indeed priced the land in their 90k valuation. As pointed out by @Brndete, it is possible that the carports come on top of the 37/130 share of the common area (that share seems small based on the snapshot provided. Is the back area used only by the owners of the plot 4976 and would have no use at all for you (or the opposite, would you have no use of the area situated on the left side of the snapshot)?
If you are having further doubts, I’d contact a professional to act as support for your aquisition (architect or general contractor).
If that were the case, why make this setup in the first place? Isn’t such an Anmerkungsgrundstück used in cases like a shared private road? Otherwise, they could just split the old plot in 2 and give the blue plot any required access rights to reach the house?
Easier answer first - the house is already built and ready to move in next month.
On the land area, I got clarification from the seller today that only 37/130 split is applicable for house 23b and that the land area is 267m2. According to him, the agent made the mistake in the sales brochure. But, that does not change the valuation as expected.
If you see the land area split, it divides the original plot of 535m2 in exactly 2 halves. Just that the individual area for house 23b is bigger and the share of the common area for house 23a is bigger to make it equal.
Right of usage - Upto now, my understanding from the Grudbuch document is that the owner of house 23b would have unrestricted access to the 2 carports and right of using the common land area as access to the second house. I will ask this specifically to clarify.
They have used SIA 416 to calculate the ‘Kubatur’ (cubic metres). So, I will look up this standard for the ceiling height consideration. Thanks.
They will be situated in the yellow area in front of plot 4976. I’ve tried to represent it below (not able to orient the boxes as per the photo). Hope this explains.
Thank you for all the replies upto now, this is really helpful.
In my discussion with the seller today, he suggested that the banks value the property lower to hedge their risk and for the buyer to cough up more cash than 20%. He then went on about some contact at a bank who he has spoken with that will provide the mortgage considering the asking price.
When I made it clear to him that I would not go ahead with the current asking price as the valuation from the banks that I have contacted is significantly lower, he suggested to do an independent onsite valuation by a third-party.
I had the same idea earlier (as the banks only do the valuation based on the data in the sales brochure). I couldn’t find anyone in my search over the past few days.
Does anyone have good recommendations of a company/individual who would do an onsite valuation for a new house in Basel-Land?
It seems to me that the owner of the plot 4975 benefits more, or at least equally (if the area for the access right for 23b serves also to access 23a), than the owner of the plot 4976 of the common plot 2368. I’d check that all rights are correctly written in the Land Register but:
This has value and doesn’t seem to be reflected in the 37/130 - 93/130 split (I don’t guarantee that I’m understanding what they’ve done there correctly). The valuation may be right and the difference would account for those usage rights. Pursuant to @Brndete’s remark, I’d also check how the expenses related to the common plot will be handled (snow, maintenance, repairs).
Others may know someone. I’d ask your bank for a recommendation so that they may also consider that valuation for their own calculations (though they may not, I’m not learned in how much openess banks are willing to provide in regards to assessing real estate).
That’s a good question. I don’t thoroughly understand what they’ve tried to do there.
In that case, I would think the owner of plot 4975 (house 23b) should pay the owner of plot 4976 (house 23a) rather than to the seller.
I am also not sure, but putting it as part of valuation would possibly be double-counting some portion (taking 93/130 for house 23a and taking 65/130 instead of 37/130 for house 23b).
Bumping this question up in case others have missed this in all the other discussion -
Does anyone have good recommendations of a company/individual who would do an onsite valuation for a new house in Basel-Land?
Thanks in advance!
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