US-ETFs (VT for instance) not available anymore in Switzerland?

If the button at the end of the message is something like “I agree”, this means that you are either 1 or 2, with this statement Swissquote is compliant with law. Nobody will check if you lied or not.

In Switzerland, High net worth individual is from 5 millions.

Yes, that’s indeed the commonly accepted non legal definition. For the purpose of the law wrt professsional status, the limit is 2M: https://www.fedlex.admin.ch/eli/cc/2019/758/en#art_5

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Let’s ask the shit out of IB’s, DEGIRO’s and swissquote’s customer service until then!

Thanks for the link. Background is here: Federal Council extends transitional period for key information document for complex financial instruments

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So it seems that we got another year?

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Reading the rational of the change, it’s mostly focused on funds requirement on KIID formats (to align with the EU side of the change which also got delayed).

For a broker there isn’t much reason to wait (if they think they’ll have to withdraw access, e.g. like UBS did a year ago, not sure why they’d wait last minute).

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Ever heard of customer service?
I‘m sure they‘ll just update their data when they know the exact date.

Swissquote‘s answer would never fly in a neighbouring EU state.

Then again, we’re not an EU member. :sweat_smile:

Aren’t they more or less stating that in that case the client use swissquote as an execution only broker/reverse solicitation? (which is one of the case covered by the regulation)

I have seen such example too. I searched for a cheaper MSCI World alternative and found the AMUNDI PRIME GLOBAL ETF which is only for institutional customers in switzerland. I can buy it nonetheless via IB though but the support gave me more or less the same answer like Swissquote in this thread.

I’ve just bought 19 shares of VT now, still available for us in Switzerland.

No error or warning messages :upside_down_face:

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Bought 1 VTI today, no issues.

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Swissquote sent a communication in Nov 2021 stating that they have updated their General terms and conditions to comply with the new law, they say they are providing execution services only:

“The Federal Act on Financial Services (FinSA) and the related Ordinance on Financial Services (FinSO) came into effect on 1 January 2020. A transition period of two years was granted from that date, meaning that most of the provisions will be effective from 1 January 2022. We have already introduced specific provisions to bring our General Terms and Conditions in line with this new law.”

Update to GT&C:
"3.3 Unless indicated otherwise, the obligations of the Bank
in relation to Transactions are limited to execution-only
services. The Bank will not perform any verification
of suitability or appropriateness as part of executiononly services provided to the Client. This information
is provided to the Client only once in these General
Terms and Conditions and will not be repeated each time
the Client enters into a Transaction.
3.4 Before investing in a particular financial instrument, the
Client should carefully consider any prospectus,
termsheet, key investor information document and
financial reports published in respect of the relevant
financial instruments. If they are not displayed on the
Trading Platforms and upon request, the Bank will provide
the Client with electronic copies of such documents,
provided they have been produced and the Bank has
received them beforehand. "

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As I understand it, no, it’s completely legal. FIDLEG/PRIIPs are supposed to protect retail investors. Non complying would be an issue for the broker (if it’s not execution-only), not the investor.

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Swissquote believe they have complied with the law. My question is who is really going to challenge their position

I could envisage 2 scenarios:

  1. Other ETF providers who are preparing the Key Information Documents complain that there is not a level playing field and try to force SQ to only sell funds with the KID

  2. An investor buys an ETF with no KID and with high fees. They claim they were unaware of the high fees and try to reclaim them from SQ

I’m not sure what would be the issue, reverse solicitation is explicitly allowed in the law and they make it pretty clear that’s what they’re doing (and what they’re doing is what we’ve expected pure brokers to do when the law comes in force).

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Sorry for the stupid question, I should make my first VT investment with IBKR, is there a guide to do it? I had found something on the blog but it seems dated to me (2017). I saw the VT ETF on IBKR where Arka is named, is that correct? Do you know if there is also an accumulation version or is it only with dividends?

I have a guide here: How To Buy An ETF On Interactive Brokers The Easy Way - The Poor Swiss

US ETFs are generally distributing. Accumulating ETFs are an European thing. And ARCA is correct, it’s for NYSE ARC, the new york stock exchange.

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New to this as well, thanks for the details. Friends who work at the big banks have advised me against investing in these as brokers like IBKR are somewhat of a loophole and it could be a big headache when it comes to tax returns. What’s everyone’s take on that?

Do we know how reinvested dividends could be treated by tax law once legislation is fully in place? (i.e. new trade) Foreseeing some more tax reporting challenges here.

Thanks!

Try searching

  • ictax
  • W-8 BEN
  • VT
  • IB
  • IBKR

in this forum and relate your remaining questions to an existing post.