# Update: 3.5 years since starting my investment journey
**URL:** https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427
**Category:** Share your story
**Created:** [June 9, 2023, 8:54am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427 "2023-06-09T08:54:13Z")
**Posts on this page:** 9
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@anon17469660](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/anon17469660)
#### Post date: [June 11, 2023, 8:03pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427/23 "2023-06-11T20:03:30Z")
Please take this with a large (more than twice-your-age-Gen-X sized) grain of salt … not really atuned to your generation and so probably not really providing useful commentary for you. 🙂
> [@preparations](#):
>
> Note: I know that these values are in no way ordinary for a 23 year old. Where the money came from has already been answered in the initial post. I just wanted to write this post to get some input and also document my journey and maybe share my experiences as this is a very rare situation that I’m in. In general I don’t really talk about money, there’s only one person (my mother) that knows about this.
>
> […]
>
> I’m actually the fourth generation and managing to keep/grow it pretty well. Looking at the other side of the family, the third generation is blowing it as we speak.
Just echoing what @rolandinho has stated already: I am amazed how sensibly you are thinking about these things are your age. Congratulations on that achievement already!
I was pretty smart at your age but super dumb moneywise. Like nowhere near the level you seem to be at.
You seem self-aware and smart moneywise.
I hope you don’t perceive this particular comment as patronizing - all I want to say is that I perceive your perspective as pretty mature, much more than mine ever was at that age.
> [@preparations](#):
>
> My current portfolio looks like this:
>
> Private equity in companies:
> Company 1: 2’332’000 CHF
> Company 2: 448’000 CHF
> Company 3: 25’000 CHF (small startup investment)
>
> Real estate (amount of equity):
> Property 1: 700’000 CHF (where I live)
> Property 2: 150’000 CHF (rented)
>
> Stocks:
> 560’000 CHF (VT)
>
> Crypto:
> 210’000 CHF (70/30 BTC/ETH)
>
> 3a:
> 46’000 CHF (99% stocks)
>
> Physical assets:
> 70’000 CHF collectibles (mainly watches)
> 15’000 CHF car
>
> Cash:
> 400’000 CHF
>
> **Total: 4’956’000 CHF**
I would not have the guts for this kind of (concentrated) diversification.
I know people (like Buffett et al) say there’s higher returns with more concentrated portfolios, but there is also higher risk. If you can afford the risk, fine.\*
Your company 1 and 2 investments are the most eyebrow rising to me. In your position I would probably not diversify this into the hundred+ companies as I did (since I can take less risk and you can take more), but distributing more than half your total assets into just two companies would make me very nervous.
That said …
(a) you seem to know these companies and can probably better qualify your risks versus a broader market,
(b) perhaps these companies themselves are really well diversified for their returns,
(c) you have enough substantiated insider info that these companies will do well
… that you’re comfortable with that asset allocation.
If I were you at my age (impossible, I know) I would diversify your company 1 and 2 holding (assuming they’re liquid at the valuations you cite) into
- (preferrably) a dividend growth strategy if you want to and have the time to look at individual companies, valuations, and a bunch more of fundamentals. I am convinced this gives you the highest returns. [Details here.](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/any-stockpickers-out-there/8203)
- plain vanilla low cost ETFs. S&P 500, more VT, you name it, if you can’t be bothered with individual companies. I’d still recommend averaging into them (versum lump sum allocation), just for psychological reasons.
Cash position is fine as long as you don’t need a return, though currently treasuries are probably just as attractive if not better.
Crypto? Speculative … maybe? Long term, no.
* * *
\* I personnally would not have the guts for more concentration until my total portfolio value reached the stage that even with a 50% total drawdown I would never even fear running out of money ever.
Probably at least low 8 figures CHF for me.
Perhaps with your current yearly expenses and your total equity, this might be fine, though?
> [@preparations](#):
>
> Yearly Income (everything is net, before taxes):
> 9 to 5 job: 78’000 CHF
> Dividends from company 1+2: 100’000 CHF
> Salary from company 1+2: 26’000 CHF
> Sidehustle: 15’000 CHF
> Property 2: 15’000 CHF
>
> **Total: 234’000 CHF**
Nice.
It’s just about what I am aiming for (income wise), but (ideally) purely from dividends.
At your stage, this allows you to “snowball” (further invest) at a very nice accumulation rate.
Given your basis, current expenses and funds available for reinvestments, you should be doing very well going forward.
Congrats again.
> [@preparations](#):
>
> My expenses are generally pretty low. Maybe like 1-2k/month. Most of that is just for food/eating out, hobbies and vacations.
>
> Current thoughts/questions:
>
> Just a few days ago I received a sizeable windfall (375k CHF, that’s why my cash holdings are that big, usually I leave around 5k cash) in the form of a Schenkung due to the sale of a house belonging to my grandparents. I‘m not sure yet what I‘m going to do with this money. I lean towards just dumping it in VT altogether. I’d split it over like 4-6 months. I know that lumpsum investing usually wins but this is quite a big part of my liquid portfolio so I wouldn’t want to risk it. Rental Properties don‘t make that much sense with the current mortgage rates (got lucky with a 0.9% 10y fixed mortgage for property 2) and I‘m already quite exposed to RE (Company 1 has all of its value due to RE holdings).
>
> If I do invest it all into VT I‘ll soon approach the 1M mark in IBKR. I‘ll probably look into splitting this on two brokers just to have some peace of mind. I know that the chances of something like FTX happening with IBKR are pretty low but I’d rather be more careful as I lost quite a bit of money on FTX.
I understand your concern, though I’d look at it from a liquidity perspective.
The funds held in custody at any broker will always be yours. When you get them in a bancruptcy situation it anyone’s guess, but you’ll get them eventually. Question is whether you’ll get by in the mean time.
I would not have any issues with holding all my assets at one broker as long as my guaranteed cash flow (from other operations) would cover my expenses (which appears to be true in your current situation).
Oh, and I am sorry you lost money with FTX, but comparing FTX to IBKR seems like comparing, ahem, say, Coinbase to Treasuries, in current market situation terms? One thing ain’t like the other, stability wise.
> [@preparations](#):
>
> My mother and I both live in property 1. Her dream has always been to be able to build a new house for her retirement. We are in the process of finalising the details and start construction after the summer. Total costs will be 1.5M (excluding land, we already own that). We probably won’t have to bring in any more Eigenkapital as our current mortgage is pretty low and we could stock that up.
> Financially this whole thing doesn‘t make much sense but I want to support her in achieving this dream and having a happy retirement. Property 1 will be kept and rented out afterwards which should be able to (almost?) pay for the mortgage of this newly built house and property 1‘s mortgage.
>
> I‘m also thinking about seeking professional help in the form of therapy. I struggle with anxiety and sometimes I have trouble finding purpose in my life. I also catch myself debating why I‘m even working for 78k/year when I have all of this money laying around. I‘d probably wait until next year to choose a 300 CHF health insurance deductible. I can already hear my mother saying „Bei den Reichen lernt man sparen.“. Has somebody here made any experiences with talking about financial stuff at a therapist?
>
> Feel free to ask me anything and please let me know if you have and suggestions or inputs.
I’m afraid I cannot really offer much advide on either issue.
Owning or building your dream property is something I would pursue given nearly infinite funds. Given my finite funds, I have the same reservations you already have.
---
### Author:  [@preparations](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/preparations)
#### Post date: [June 12, 2023, 7:14am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427/24 "2023-06-12T07:14:38Z")
I do not, I wouldn’t be cut out for that, I prefer autodidacticism
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### Author:  [@preparations](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/preparations)
#### Post date: [June 12, 2023, 7:15am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427/25 "2023-06-12T07:15:23Z")
I do. I also enjoy learning about new topics within that field and exploring stuff. I wouldn’t give it up completely
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### Author:  [@preparations](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/preparations)
#### Post date: [June 12, 2023, 7:32am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427/26 "2023-06-12T07:32:54Z")
> [@anon17469660](#):
>
> I am amazed how sensibly you are thinking about these things are your age. Congratulations on that achievement already!
Thank you very much, I appreciate that a lot and I didn’t perceive it as patronizing at all.
> [@anon17469660](#):
>
> I would not have the guts for this kind of (concentrated) diversification.
This is kind of a special allocation which I won’t be changing for now. I inherited these shares and will be inheriting the whole company at one point. I am considering selling the company once I fully own it but now it wouldn’t make much sense. Also, both companies are growing really well and are in good industries so I’m not really worried about them going belly up.
But I completely understand where you’re coming from. If I had this money in a cash allocation I wouldn’t make such concentrated bets. I’d invest it into VT. Stockpicking/Dividend growth strategy is not really my thing.
> [@anon17469660](#):
>
> The funds held in custody at any broker will always be yours. When you get them in a bancruptcy situation it anyone’s guess, but you’ll get them eventually. Question is whether you’ll get by in the mean time.
Completely agree that comparing FTX to IBKR is not really a valid comparison. I also know that technically the shares that the broker holds for me are held in my name and should eventually get to me in case of a bankruptcy. BUT we are only talking about brokers that don’t have anything shady going on - you never know. Better safe than sorry in my opinion.
Thanks for your detailed response
---
### Author:  [@Dr.PI](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Dr.PI)
#### Post date: [June 12, 2023, 8:28am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427/27 "2023-06-12T08:28:28Z")
> [@preparations](#):
>
> I also know that technically the shares that the broker holds for me are held in my name and should eventually get to me in case of a bankruptcy. BUT we are only talking about brokers that don’t have anything shady going on - you never know. Better safe than sorry in my opinion.
There are options, if you are interested.
- Both iShares and Vanguard IE have options of investing directly in mutual fund classes starting from amounts of 500k or 1m.
- Swisscanto mutual funds are probably the safest mutual funds for Swiss investors.
- Swissquote claim to register shares directly with the central securities depositary, although I haven’t yet figured out how to verify that.
- Finally there are options of holding shares directly with the central securities depositary, although I don’t know details.
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### Author:  [@user137](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/user137)
#### Post date: [June 13, 2023, 12:22pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427/28 "2023-06-13T12:22:21Z")
@preparations just an idea, but traveling the world is usually a good “investment” for your future. Seeing different people and cultures work and live.
Congratulations on being so savvy and aware so young.
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### Author:  [@preparations](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/preparations)
#### Post date: [June 14, 2023, 12:32pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427/29 "2023-06-14T12:32:25Z")
That’s pretty interesting, thank you.
I’ll probably look into investing with Vanguard IE once I get to like 1.5m in VT.
> [@Dr.PI](#):
>
> Swissquote claim to register shares directly with the central securities depositary, although I haven’t yet figured out how to verify that.
Here’s the response their livechat representative gave me:
“als Kunde ist es nicht möglich dies zu überprüfen”
I then asked if these claims are just based on the customer trusting Swissquote that they actually do that.
“Ja, wir haben eine Banklizenz. Wir haben eine Banklizenz und unterstehen der FINMA. Wenn wir im Geschäft bleiben wollen, müssen wir bestimmte Verfahren einhalten.”
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### Author:  [@Carambau](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Carambau)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2023, 12:51pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427/30 "2023-06-15T12:51:49Z")
Good on you for achieving that at a young age. Most people are asking why work a 9-5 - I have a different take
- You have a side hustle
- Clearly you enjoy it otherwise you wouldn’t do it (you don’t need the 15K)
Why don’t you go all in on the side hustle?
- Do you need help growing it?
- Is there a skill you can build or hire that would transform the side hustle into a 10x or 100x business?
If it’s digital (e-commerce, newsletter, online courses, etc) related ping me and we can talk and share experiences.
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### Author:  [@preparations](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/preparations)
#### Post date: [June 15, 2023, 1:56pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/update-3-5-years-since-starting-my-investment-journey/10427/31 "2023-06-15T13:56:44Z")
> [@Carambau](#):
>
> Why don’t you go all in on the side hustle?
I thought about that too but this is simply not scalable, the income from it will rather go down over the next few years.
But yes, starting a serious side hustle/startup would also be a pretty interesting adventure.
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