Mate, are you for real or trolling? I think you’re trolling tbh, and doing it well too!
Expected average is market return minus fees, so the expected return if beating the market consistently is possible, would be imo at most a couple percentage points above market return.
There is free material on this available - the mentioned content creator is only selling 1:1 mentoring and I think a scanner software (which one can replicate for free with some effort).
And there are people living from this IRL - they didn’t get there by accepting 10% p.a. - as I said certain stocks move like 500% over a few mins/hours a day, if you can just capture a fraction of that you can make a years worth of “classic” returns, but the percentage comparison is a bit odd, because in reality, you maybe make 400 CHF on 2000 CHF - percentage wise a big deal, but not really life changing.
I am NOT trolling ![]()
In all seriousness - but in order for day trading and especially trading for a few secs/mins per trade to be profitable, you need very abnormal returns (or rather capture a fraction of astronomical returns).
For making 1-2 or even 5% more than by just doing VT and chill, it isn’t worth trying, why would I take on so much work to make like 10-20K more a year - I might as well just cheat on the timesheet of my job, far less hassle (this is a joke obviously).
Two observations:
Trading with small or micro caps (edit: or pink sheets) invites pump and dump schemes. The Plain Bagle has a series about such social media advice.
On the other side of literal daytrading, there are Jane Street, high frequency trading algos and such.
That thinking/logic can drive taking way too much risk though
As you state, it’s a matter of scale. Your salary is nominal and you are happy to work for it (or cheat on the timesheet if that’s more valuable to you - if that’s what you’re doing and your employer is paying you money enough to play it on the markets, maybe everything is simply just working as intended). Day trading is an active activity. It is a job (or a side hustle). I would think in nominal terms, not percentage gains. How much are you expecting it to make for you and do you consider that good enough value for your time?
But honestly, at this point, just go for it. Either you’ll get rich and will have the additional pleasure of sticking it to us in this thread, or you’ll loose money and we can all do with a bit of increased average market returns that we would collect through index funds.
What return do you target per annum and using how much capital?
I really don’t plan on sticking it to anyone ![]()
And since I have actually quite solid money habits it’s kind of a sacreledge to even talk about this, more so to fund an account and start trading. But maybe I’ll try a simulator. It’d just be interesting to hear if someone did something similar or thoguht about it ![]()
Honestly, from what you have expressed here, I don’t think you have the temperament to make it work.
I’ll be glad to stand corrected on that.
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(Oh the anticipation. I’m so mitigated now that @Mirager mentioned trolling… Will there be links popping up or is it just naivety paired with some finfluencing?)
Between not beating the market and 10% week to 1% per day at the moment apparently. Down from 25% a week.
Statistical anomalies are a bit weird as well.
Like sure, 80-95% of daytraders lose money, but that doesn’t mean a lot. It’s like saying 80-95% of the people going to the gym stop going after 6 months or something. I also learned a foreign language to C2 fluency as an adult - there is also just a very small minority of language learners who does that and in the language learning space, there’s just as much, if not more snake oil to be sold.
I do beleive that dedication to a skill combined with a good learning method is a very good framework to succeed at any skill in life - and that may lead to exceptional results later on. If you would filter for example on how many day traders are profitable that trained for a year in the simulator and only took 1-2 trades a day that matched their desired strategy, the data would likely look different - but I have no evidence for thos.
If I alwyas looked at probabilities before making decisions, I wouldn’t be where I am at today, and I do beleive that I have certain skills where I might be in the top percentiles of human beings (not day trading lol).
Does this exist though?
(For daytrading ofc, obviously very much proven to be possible in language learning.)
It’s not about statistics or statistical anomalies. It’s about stacking the odds in your favour.
If you thought you had those skills for day trading you would not have added that parenthesis. Those skills for daytrading would be stacking the odds in your favour. Not having them is stacking them against you.
Honestly I just don’t know - I think that’s why I ask others. If I beleived I’d know it does, I wouldn’t be asking.
Ah ok. Well from the impression that I get from your sources via what you’re reporting, I wouldn’t trust those.
Honestly, I kind of agree…
Also, I’d be obviously in it for the money, not because I like looking at charts so much or because I care for the economy. That in combination with most of my NW being tied in passive index funds and a flat makes me a rather bad candidate I guess… at least it doesn’t speak for me due to my loss aversion - on the other hand, I also don’t get too greedy I think, compared to some let’s say "crypto bros
Is that based on hard facts?
Also when you are lazy?