# Should I give up stock picking (unfortunately I have only made 15K profit since 2018). I can probably only retire at 80 :-(
**URL:** https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547
**Category:** Investing / Others
**Created:** [November 13, 2024, 4:34am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547 "2024-11-13T04:34:04Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Andrews1998](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Andrews1998)
#### Post date: [November 13, 2024, 4:34am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/1 "2024-11-13T04:34:04Z")
Hi
I’m totally letting my pants down and showing screenshots of Swissquote.
I am not at all satisfied with this mini-profit. I’m thinking about getting out of investing and concentrating on other things.
Can you please interpret these figures? How bad are they really? At least I haven’t lost any money, but the profit is ridiculously small.
> Absolute Performance ab x/x/2018 15’377.53CHF
> TWR +104.80%
> MWR +97.43%
What is TWR and MWR exaclty? What is your TWR and MWR, plase also screenshots.
I hope you are more successful than I am in the financial world
# failed
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### Author:  [@dbu](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/dbu)
#### Post date: [November 13, 2024, 5:09am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/2 "2024-11-13T05:09:43Z")
_(Taking a chance on potentially answering to a troll post, hope I’m not wasting time)_
1st: Absolute amounts mean absolutely nothing - another person’s amount could be 10x larger, but maybe they invested 1M CHF (or 1k).
So no sense to compare those.
You would have more if you invested more.
2nd: 100% profit over 6 years?
That’s perfectly normal if you went the typical all-world ETF route, and even better than the usual expected “7% + rule of 72 = 10 years”.
3rd: If you expected more return, you should have taken up way more risks.
Try your luck at the crypto casino maybe…
(But be ready to digest the risks)
Conclusion:
No.
Just keep on continuously investing and the pot will continue to compound and grow.
We all had to start somewhere.
And feel lucky you didn’t (yet) catch one of the 2001/2008 shaekups - who knows how you’d be reacting then…
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### Author:  [@Abs\_max](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Abs_max)
#### Post date: [November 13, 2024, 6:26am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/3 "2024-11-13T06:26:15Z")
Could you also share what was your expectation when you started investing?
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### Author:  [@Mirager](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Mirager)
#### Post date: [November 13, 2024, 6:59am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/4 "2024-11-13T06:59:18Z")
“You made 100% profit while doing absolutely nothing” is another way to think about it. That’s totally free money. You didn’t fail at anything.
Looks like you put some money in in 2018 and left it, 6 years later that money doubled. That’s above expectations as dbu wrote. If you had continued putting money the pot would have been a lot bigger.
If you don’t want to save and invest more then you can leave it and look at it grow over time, and get a fancy car or something in 20 years (no good driver’s cars will be available then but that’s another story!). Or you can take the profit out and give a gift to yourself right now with it. In 20 years’ time you may run the numbers and realise you’d have had a ton more money if you’d continued saving 😉
This forum is focused on saving, living below one’s means, and investing, but it’s not the whole world. What we do here is unthinkable to most people, and the flipside, what most people do outside is seen as a little foolish by some of us here.
However you so say “I’ll retire by 80”, suggesting you don’t want that, so perhaps get busy putting more money in!
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### Author:  [@PhilMongoose](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/PhilMongoose)
#### Post date: [November 13, 2024, 11:16am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/5 "2024-11-13T11:16:40Z")
Seeing the title of this thread, I expected somebody had done some usual beginner trading and ended up with a 3% return.
Instead, I see 100% return. I think I’m setting my own expectations too low!
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### Author:  [@nugget](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/nugget)
#### Post date: [November 13, 2024, 11:40am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/6 "2024-11-13T11:40:47Z")
no one with those returns questions their investment choices, as long as the typical passive private investor is the benchmark.
may it be more a lifestyle/ savings issue?
10k/year saved at those levels of return should result in 120k
Not sure what this is about^^
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### Author:  [@dbu](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/dbu)
#### Post date: [November 13, 2024, 12:05pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/7 "2024-11-13T12:05:19Z")
> [@nugget](#):
>
> may it be more a lifestyle/ savings issue?
Maybe the abstinence crisis from [“Waterdrop”](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/total-rip-off-waterdrop-advertising-from-die-hohle-der-lowen-is-there-a-cheaper-alternative-to-buy-in-switzerland/13545/1) was too strong in the end.
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### Author:  [@Luk\_nuts](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Luk_nuts)
#### Post date: [November 13, 2024, 1:56pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/8 "2024-11-13T13:56:50Z")
Why zero return in year 1 though? 🙂
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### Author:  [@Andrews1998](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Andrews1998)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 5:05am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/9 "2024-11-14T05:05:45Z")
First of all, thanks to everyone for their answers. I didn’t expect this to be a good result (my small profit). I was very surprised when I read the answers.
> [@Mirager](#):
>
> “You made 100% profit while doing absolutely nothing” is another way to think about it. That’s totally free money. You didn’t fail at anything.
This is not true at all. I spent a lot of my free time researching stocks and companies on the internet. I have invested a lot of time. **This is also the origin of my question: is it worth all the lost free time to have 15K profit?**
Why have I invested so little? I have only taken so much money for shares, which I can totally lose in the worst case. I have more money in my savings account, but I don’t want to risk that (total loss).
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### Author:  [@Andrews1998](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Andrews1998)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 5:10am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/10 "2024-11-14T05:10:20Z")
> [@dbu](#):
>
> 2nd: 100% profit over 6 years?
> That’s perfectly normal if you went the typical all-world ETF route, and even better than the usual expected “7% + rule of 72 = 10 years”.
maybe this is where my mistake lies. I have bought almost no ETFs, but individual shares. It was also a lot of effort to research each company. Some of the shares went down 80% when I bought them, others went up sharply.
i think that’s my big mistake, the reason why i lost so much free time.
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### Author:  [@Mirager](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Mirager)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 5:50am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/11 "2024-11-14T05:50:23Z")
Heh you are a living case for being a lazy passive investor like most (but not all) of us here. In that case it’s still been a success in everyone’s books.
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### Author:  [@Andrews1998](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Andrews1998)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 6:26am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/12 "2024-11-14T06:26:05Z")
I don’t understand your statement. Even with a translator. What you wish to say?
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### Author:  [@FunnyDjo](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/FunnyDjo)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 7:16am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/13 "2024-11-14T07:16:23Z")
If you keep going with this strategy on the coming years, we could compare a 100% stock picking strategy versus a passive etf based strategy.
You should contribute on the stock picking thread.
Most of the members have an etf strategy.
In my case I own 75% etf on my global investment and 25% of stock picking which represent 10% of fun money on my global portfolio.
Your amount invested is quiet small but how can you continue this strategy with half million or 1 millions invested in stock picking shares ?
How many stocks do you manage ? What will be your ideal number of investments ?
Your investment in each company will represent 50-100k and for myself above 10k on one company I start to not sleep well when one lose 80% of it’s value.
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### Author:  [@dbu](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/dbu)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 7:31am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/14 "2024-11-14T07:31:10Z")
> [@Andrews1998](#):
>
> What you wish to say?
Stop picking stocks and buy the index.
“Get rich quick” strategies work only with huge amount of luck.
Or (rather and) huge amount of expertise and time - which probably none, or very few, of us have the luxury to spend.
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### Author:  [@SwissTeslaBull](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/SwissTeslaBull)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 7:41am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/15 "2024-11-14T07:41:04Z")
Reallocate to 60/40 VWRL and IBIT and check in 10 years. Be happy in between ✅
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### Author:  [@nabalzbhf](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/nabalzbhf)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 7:42am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/16 "2024-11-14T07:42:40Z")
> [@Andrews1998](#):
>
> i think that’s my big mistake, the reason why i lost so much free time
What did you expect going in?
If you have like 10k, and you don’t find it fun doing stock picking/speculating, it’s definitely not worth your time. If it’s diversified enough, you’d likely get similar returns to the stock market (so maybe like 5% per year on avg with large variance).
Were you hoping for finding the next stock that will go 10000% up? That’s more like playing the lottery than investing.
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### Author:  [@Mirager](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Mirager)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 8:11am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/17 "2024-11-14T08:11:15Z")
Didn’t mean you are lazy or anything, it’s just a sort of slogan for passive (because they don’t pick stocks/time the market) and lazy (because they buy passive, long-only index funds) investors, ie investors who just buy index funds and do nothing. I thought these are index fund returns but actually VWRL (FTSE all world) did 52% and VUAA (S&P500) did 84% in CHF, in the last 5 years, so your stock picking beat indices by A LOT. So your effort and time were in no way wasted.
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### Author:  [@PhilMongoose](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/PhilMongoose)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 9:09am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/18 "2024-11-14T09:09:50Z")
> [@Andrews1998](#):
>
> i think that’s my big mistake, the reason why i lost so much free time.
For small amounts it doesn’t make sense to invest in individual shares. The amount of work you do is the same whether you buy 1 share or 1 million shares.
I think individual shares start to make sense when you have \>1 million. Otherwise you are making less than a minimum wage job.
For small amounts, you can just stick it in a Pillar 3a and forget about it.
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### Author:  [@ma0](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/ma0)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 9:18am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/19 "2024-11-14T09:18:14Z")
I think OP totally miswrote the original post. What it should be instead:
I wasted a lot of time researching stocks and I just got 100% return. I might give up stock picking.
The answer would be: 100% return is good, but if you feel you spent too much time on it to just get that return, you should give up stock picking and invest in ETFs. If instead you think it’s the return that’s too low, well maybe you can get more by researching even more, but I believe you won’t like that (also risky).
End of thread 😃
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### Author:  [@EPeon](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/EPeon)
#### Post date: [November 14, 2024, 6:39pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547/20 "2024-11-14T18:39:09Z")
> [@ma0](#):
>
> The answer would be: 100% return is good, but if you feel you spent too much time on it to just get that return, you should give up stock picking and invest in ETFs.
Or perhaps alternatively: If you are dead convinced of your strategy, invest a higher amount.
[Next page](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/should-i-give-up-stock-picking-unfortunately-i-have-only-made-15k-profit-since-2018-i-can-probably-only-retire-at-80/14547.md?page=2)