# Pillar 3a - In the future maybe additional payment possible **URL:** \ **Category:** Banks, Insurances & Third Pillar\ **Created:** [June 2, 2020, 8:03pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961 "2020-06-02T20:03:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![PhilMongoose](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/user_avatar/forum.mustachianpost.com/philmongoose/32/12331_2.png) [@PhilMongoose](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/PhilMongoose)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2023, 4:34pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/149 "2023-11-21T16:34:45Z")
You still have time to pay for 2023 ---
**Author:** ![nkbhnomfcmmwxdlula](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/n/df788c/32.png) [@nkbhnomfcmmwxdlula](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/nkbhnomfcmmwxdlula)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2023, 8:01pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/150 "2023-11-21T20:01:34Z")
Which Pillar 3a is the cheapest way (lowest TER, including FX and transaction fees) to invest all my money in SP500? I’ve also heard that US no longer withholds the 15% tax on dividends for shares held in 3a, right? ---
**Author:** ![Wolverine](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/user_avatar/forum.mustachianpost.com/wolverine/32/3315_2.png) [@Wolverine](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Wolverine)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2023, 8:56pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/151 "2023-11-21T20:56:17Z")
Finpension would be the cheapest, though I don’t understand the apparent sudden lust for the S&P500 we are seeing on this board. US funds have one of the best tax treatment possible for Swiss investors: low dividends and fully recoverable witholding taxes if held through a US domiciled fund (given your regular taxes outweigh the tax savings and you fill the right paperwork). They are best held outside of tax advantaged accounts (that is, there are other funds that would benefit more from it). Why US stocks specifically? ---
**Author:** ![nkbhnomfcmmwxdlula](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/n/df788c/32.png) [@nkbhnomfcmmwxdlula](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/nkbhnomfcmmwxdlula)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2023, 10:17pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/152 "2023-11-21T22:17:51Z")
Thank you, I will go with Finpension. ---
**Author:** ![jay](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/j/ed8c4c/32.png) [@jay](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/jay)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2023, 5:05am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/153 "2023-11-22T05:05:49Z")
To clarify, finpension doesn’t actually offer a fund tracking the S&P 500. However, it offers a MSCI USA pension fund without US WHT and without extra fees. The performance should be close to the S&P 500. ---
**Author:** ![OrientExpress](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/o/e95f7d/32.png) [@OrientExpress](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/OrientExpress)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2023, 3:16pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/154 "2023-11-22T15:16:30Z")
There is an article in [Tages-Anzeiger](https://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/dritte-saeule-sparen-vorsorge-rueckwirkend-460545033144) on this topic today. Here are the relevant parts: > Der Bundesrat hat am Mittwoch eine entsprechende Verordnungsänderung in die Vernehmlassung geschickt. Er handelt dabei im Auftrag des Parlaments, das vor drei Jahren eine entsprechende Motion des Obwaldner Mitte-Ständerats Erich Ettlin angenommen hatte. > **Allerdings soll es bloss möglich sein, Beitragslücken zu stopfen, die nach Inkrafttreten der Verordnungsänderung entstehen.** Ein Einkauf setzt voraus, dass im betreffenden Jahr der ordentliche Jahresbeitrag vollständig entrichtet wird. Remainder of the article is mostly about lost taxes due to this new rule. ---
**Author:** ![Luk\_nuts](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/user_avatar/forum.mustachianpost.com/luk_nuts/32/9302_2.png) [@Luk\_nuts](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Luk_nuts)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2023, 6:09pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/155 "2023-11-22T18:09:54Z")
Here the official news: [Bundesrat will nachträgliche Einkäufe in die Säule 3a ermöglichen (admin.ch)](https://www.admin.ch/gov/de/start/dokumentation/medienmitteilungen.msg-id-98831.html) ---
**Author:** ![anon17469660](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/13edae/32.png) [@anon17469660](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/anon17469660)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2023, 6:22pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/156 "2023-11-22T18:22:07Z")
Nothingburger for me as I’ve paid the full amount into 3a in the past couple of decades (insert angry-old-man-shakes-fist-at-the-sky meme here). Hopefully though a useful tax efficient saving opportunity for younger folks (and of course older folks who missed out in the past decade). Thanks for sharing, @OrientExpress ! ---
**Author:** ![Luk\_nuts](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/user_avatar/forum.mustachianpost.com/luk_nuts/32/9302_2.png) [@Luk\_nuts](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Luk_nuts)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2023, 6:36pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/157 "2023-11-22T18:36:24Z")
> [@anon17469660](#): > > and of course older folks who missed out in the past decade As pointed out by @OrientExpress, the proposal from the Bundesrat is the following: > it should only be possible to plug contribution gaps that arise after the amendment to the ordinance comes into force. ---
**Author:** ![Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/user_avatar/forum.mustachianpost.com/cortana/32/2082_2.png) [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2023, 6:39pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/158 "2023-11-22T18:39:40Z")
Well so no real use for us. ---
**Author:** ![anon17469660](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/13edae/32.png) [@anon17469660](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/anon17469660)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2023, 6:41pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/159 "2023-11-22T18:41:59Z")
> [@Luk\_nuts](#): > > > [@anon17469660](#): > > > > and of course older folks who missed out in the past decade > > As pointed out by @OrientExpress, the proposal from the Bundesrat is the following: > > > it should only be possible to plug contribution gaps that arise after the amendment to the ordinance comes into force. Oops, my bad. Thanks for clarifying! (I’ll then shake my fist even more angrily at the sky) ---
**Author:** ![yetanothername](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/y/f4b2a3/32.png) [@yetanothername](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/yetanothername)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2023, 8:41pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/160 "2023-11-22T20:41:59Z")
It’s a proposal. Nothing has been decided yet. Parties and interest groups will add to or oppose the proposal. It has to pass both chambers. It might still come to nothing or get more or less generous. We have a more business friendly parliament. Do not despair. ---
**Author:** ![anon17469660](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/a/13edae/32.png) [@anon17469660](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/anon17469660)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2023, 9:33pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/161 "2023-11-22T21:33:26Z")
> [@yetanothername](#): > > It’s a proposal. > > … > > Do not despair. Great advice. I am not despaired. At all. ![image](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/uploads/default/original/2X/d/d8d504f9633d47745ccd339f4955e05b58ac20ef.jpeg) I also admit I am not adding anything valuable or even noteworthy here, so please just scroll on. Meow. ---
**Author:** ![skyw4lker](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/user_avatar/forum.mustachianpost.com/skyw4lker/32/12326_2.png) [@skyw4lker](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/skyw4lker)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 6:20am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/162 "2023-11-23T06:20:17Z")
The Federal Council’s proposal builds upon amending the so called BVV3 ordinance, which he can do himself without the need for parliamentary approval. Of course, it’s always possible for Parliament itself to get active and pass a new law, but that would take time. In addition, the budget preview for the coming years is very much in the red zone, so even in Parliament, with all the other potential initiatives resulting in tax revenue losses (Abschaffung Eigenmietwert, Einführung Individualbesteuerung etc.), this will chill ambitions with regard to a - for the vast majority of people - niche area. Sorry for the gloomy outlook… ---
**Author:** ![Luk\_nuts](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/user_avatar/forum.mustachianpost.com/luk_nuts/32/9302_2.png) [@Luk\_nuts](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Luk_nuts)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 1:50pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/163 "2023-11-23T13:50:47Z")
> [@yetanothername](#): > > It has to pass both chambers. It does not. > Der Bundesrat hat an seiner Sitzung vom 22. November 2023 _entsprechende Änderungen der Verordnung_ über die steuerliche Abzugsberechtigung von Beiträgen an anerkannte Vorsorgeformen (BVV 3) in die Vernehmlassung geschickt. Amendments to the ordinance do not have to be approved by the chambers. All they can do now is “react” to the proposal. ---
**Author:** ![yetanothername](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/y/f4b2a3/32.png) [@yetanothername](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/yetanothername)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 3:14pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/164 "2023-11-23T15:14:29Z")
You’re right. My political science lessons have been too long ago. It might still be amended, though. ---
**Author:** ![Baron51](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/b/cab0a1/32.png) [@Baron51](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Baron51)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2023, 10:15am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/165 "2023-11-24T10:15:55Z")
Project is in public “Vernehlassung” meaning that anybody (swiss citizen, associations, etc.) has the right to react, propose changes or criticize. All you have to do is write following the instructions displayed in the documents on this page [Fedlex](https://fedlex.data.admin.ch/eli/dl/proj/2023/22/cons_1). Deadline is 06.03.2024 After that, the concerned office will present the Vernehmlassung results in a report and propose a new version of the ordinance to the Federal Council after another intern round. ---
**Author:** ![Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/user_avatar/forum.mustachianpost.com/cortana/32/2082_2.png) [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 4:23pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/166 "2024-05-19T16:23:16Z")
As I see no changes have been made. The proposal of Alain Berset is totally different than initially anticipated. Max. 7k/year buy-ins for any missed (or not fully paid) year of the last 10 years. But not in retrospect, so only valid for missing contributions starting now. ---
**Author:** ![Yanikuza](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/user_avatar/forum.mustachianpost.com/yanikuza/32/4455_2.png) [@Yanikuza](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Yanikuza)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 4:42pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/167 "2024-05-19T16:42:03Z")
Not surprised at all, as it would only be a gift for wealthy people. ---
**Author:** ![Luk\_nuts](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/user_avatar/forum.mustachianpost.com/luk_nuts/32/9302_2.png) [@Luk\_nuts](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Luk_nuts)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 5:32pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961/168 "2024-05-19T17:32:49Z")
> [@Cortana](#): > > But not in retrospect, so only valid for missing contributions starting now. So it’s fair for people who have been contributing since they were 20 years old? 😉 [Previous page](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961.md?page=6) [Next page](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/pillar-3a-in-the-future-maybe-additional-payment-possible/3961.md?page=8)