I agree with what you’re saying. And as you can see, after years spent in this forum, where this exact topic has been addressed time and time again, there are people who will tell you VT is better, and others who will tell you to stick with VRWL. That’s because it’s a close call. As long as you’re with IB, it costs nothing to switch. I made the “mistake” of putting a lot of money in first CornerTrader and then PostFinance. Switching ETFs there would cost me something like 1’000 CHF. Ridiculous. I did it not to put all my money in IB, but it annoys me from time to time.
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This oxymoron got a smile out of me. You, sir (or madam) won an Internet, today.
Didn’t you try yuh as a swiss “backup” broker? It should be good for a buy and hold investor.
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I never had anything to do with Yuh. But why do you claim that Yuh is any better than CT or PF?
From their website:
- currency exchange fee: 0.95%
- trading of stock fee: 0.50%
So if for example I decide that oh no, I don’t want to hold 200’000 CHF worth of VWRL and I would rather hold 200’000 USD of VWRD, at Yuh it would cost:
- 1’000 CHF to sell VWRL
- 2’000 CHF to exchange CHF to USD
- 1’000 CHF to buy VWRD
4’000 CHF. This is ridiculously high.
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Why struggle? There is no struggle… With PostFinance you pay 35 CHF fee for a 10’000 CHF trade, which is 0.35% plus 0.15% for stamp duty. That sums up to exactly 0.50% per trade, or 1% for a buy + sell. With higher trade value the fee rate is even lower.
With CornerTrader, you pay 18 CHF for a 15’000 CHF trade, which is 0.12%, plus 0.15% for stamp duty. 0.27% per trade and 0.54% for buy + sell. That is much cheaper than Yuh.
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0.5% buy + 0.5% sale it’s not really like a 1% cost. You don’t know how much your asset will be worth at sale.
So you translate the unknown future value of the fee to the known present value. Neat. Didn’t think about it this way. You could say that if the buy+sell fee is 1%, then the total return on your investment will be reduced by 1%, to 99%, no matter how high that return will be.
OK. So PF becomes competitive at 10’000 per trade, and CT at 5’000. Yuh makes sense for tiny trades.
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They do offer VT.
Isn’t that an alternative for you (asking to make it a 20 characters)
So Yuh is currently the cheapest Swiss broker? I don’t want to open up an IB account for the same reason.
Can you open a new thread about it? I think I’ve missed this issue. I’ve read about a rural bank in China locking accounts, but nothing in europe.
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CornerTrader was the cheapest last time I’ve checked, if you don’t mind your stocks being held in street name and don’t want to exercise your voting rights or get sharholder compensations in kind (Calida’s pajama and the likes).
I’ve not taken more than a few seconds to check again but it seems to still be the case.
Swissquote would be my go to if I wanted to have my shares registered (I’m with TradeDirect myself due to anecdotal happenstances that I don’t consider worth correcting for).
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I started with CT, then moved to IB, and some time ago I opened a second account at Swissquote to speculate on crypto (a tiny part of my portfolio), but I think I’ll keep it for ETFs too. I’m pretty anxious about keeping all my money in one account - that’s why I have two VIAC accounts (one for me and one for my wife), two IB accounts (me+wife), and one at SQ.
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What do you think about the approach to accumulate VT to 60k USD and then switch to a IE based ETF solution (for those afraid of the US / IRS issue).
I would say a better idea is to use US ETFs for US stocks only and Ireland ETFs for the rest of the world.
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Would joint accounts help in such cases to avoid lengthy probate issues? Of course there would be other factors to consider.
It would be interesting to do this mental exercise and identify the ETFs for that, as there is no UCITS version of VXUS afaik.
Well for a starter there is the VEUR ETF which covers the European market, then you would have to find an ETF for AP and one for EM if I am not mistaken. Then the more complicated or annoying part comes where you will have to find the right proportions of each and then rebalance whenever necessary. Could be interesting to do if you have some time and fancy the extra work…
Aren’t people talking about a VT replacement (not splitting the world).
Then I guess the obvious are like VWRL and friends?