# Legality of requiring employees to use employing company's banking services
**URL:** https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986
**Category:** Coffee
**Created:** [March 14, 2023, 1:02pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986 "2023-03-14T13:02:19Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@Helix](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Helix)
#### Post date: [August 18, 2023, 4:06pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/25 "2023-08-18T16:06:38Z")
> [@StolenOrgan](#):
>
> You are not required to _use_ the company’s bank account, you are only required to _receive_ your salary on it.
The bank account is not the problem. Forced choice in brokerage services is.
> [@Slutmachine](#):
>
> you cannot blame them for accepting something you knew beforehand
I mean, yes you can, if what they want is illegal. There are reasons for not allowing total freedom of contract, no matter how transparent it is.
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### Author:  [@Bob](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Bob)
#### Post date: [December 3, 2024, 10:00am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/26 "2024-12-03T10:00:26Z")
Since foreign banks in Switzerland must comply with the same FINMA rules as Swiss banks, and since they don’t require employee account consolidation but accept a disclosure together with pre-clearance and trade information, it is possible that that the consolidation rules of Swiss banks might be excessive.
If you are a Swiss bank employee and you think that the required account consolidation with your employer forces you to pay higher fees or prevents you from switching to a cheaper alternative, use [this form](https://www.preisueberwacher.admin.ch/pue/de/home/dienstleistungen/preisbeanstandungen-und-mitteilungen-an-die-preisueberwachung/anonyme_meldung_ubs.html) of the Swiss Price Surveillance Authority to place an anonymous complaint.
When you do so, please don’t copy/paste this post but describe the situation in your own words.
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### Author:  [@Helix](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Helix)
#### Post date: [December 4, 2024, 11:12pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/27 "2024-12-04T23:12:25Z")
Last time I tried, I got:
> [@](#):
>
> [We understand, but] this is not a price abuse within the meaning of competition law, but a matter of civil law governing the contractual conditions that banks can impose on their employees.
>
> Furthermore, the question of whether Art. 323b para. 3 CO has been violated is a civil law matter that would have to be decided by the competent civil court in the event of a dispute.
>
> Unfortunately, the price supervisor cannot intervene in this case.
>
> We regret that we cannot give you a better answer, but hope for your understanding.
I wrote a very detailed explanation comparing fees of Swiss banks to IBKR, showing an absurd multiple of ~5 across different investment amounts.
But by all means, flood them some more. Maybe it rises on their priority list.
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### Author:  [@Abs\_max](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Abs_max)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 12:38am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/28 "2024-12-05T00:38:39Z")
So just to be clear , the expectation is that let’s say UBS should allow their employees to use IBKR? But the same employees are selling UBS brokerages and banking services to other customers.
If I think from employer perspective, the expectation to use services offered by the company is not a bad expectation
I often feel that it’s not good to cherry pick things. A job comes with a full package -: remuneration, pension plans, perks, bonuses, and some expectations
If everything else is great (assuming the offer was accepted by employee) then shouldn’t expectations be also fulfilled?
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### Author:  [@ChickenFat](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/ChickenFat)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 7:59am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/29 "2024-12-05T07:59:53Z")
> [@StolenOrgan](#):
>
> I’m not interested in _using_ any financial products from the company I work for.
Reminds me of the cook who said «I would never ever eat in my restaurant»
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### Author:  [@Mirager](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Mirager)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 8:25am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/30 "2024-12-05T08:25:01Z")
[ ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7KBcsdPhxA)
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### Author:  [@Helix](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Helix)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 10:55am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/31 "2024-12-05T10:55:53Z")
> [@Abs\_max](#):
>
> If I think from employer perspective, the expectation to use services offered by the company is not a bad expectation
As a contractual condition but for free or even compensated on top? Maybe. Else it is illegal and void.
There are other things that the employer would like, e.g. unlimited non-competes. Void. Or maybe outright buying your lifetime working output (aka. a slave). Illegal.
The relationship between employer and employee is not equal in many cases. That’s why there are laws to ensure societal goals are met. But this isn’t a politics board.
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### Author:  [@Abs\_max](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Abs_max)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 11:09am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/32 "2024-12-05T11:09:48Z")
I think you are exaggerating a bit by equating different things to brokerage services. But this isn’t politics board.
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### Author:  [@Mirager](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Mirager)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 11:43am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/33 "2024-12-05T11:43:56Z")
> [@Helix](#):
>
> Else it is illegal and void.
Has someone tried to challenge it in court? Even via an ombudsman so it remains anonymahahahahaha!
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### Author:  [@anon17469660](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/anon17469660)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 3:34pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/34 "2024-12-05T15:34:07Z")
> [@Mirager](#):
>
> Has someone tried to challenge it in court?
Legally, you’re certainly not required to bank and trade at your employer.\* The _Zivilgesetzbuch (ZGB)_ (Swiss Civil Code) would have to spell this out – it doesn’t.
However, _your_ contract with your employer may include additional terms, as apparently UBS does for the matter regarding the topic title. Those apply to you once you sign the contract.
Migros could just as easily add iffy terms to their standard work contract: as a Migros employee, you can only shop at Migros … except that everyone, including Migros, would conclude that this is perhaps a little excessive. 😉
UBS gets away with this because only a few people complain. And _if_ it became a more public topic, say via the _Preisüberwacher_, the public reaction/opinion would probably be along the lines of “oh, look at these poor bankers complaining about fees … tsk tsk”.
Anyhow …
If I were (to become) a UBS employee,
- I would first check whether I am married (or in a legally almost equivalent partnership), whether my spouse (or equivalent) doesn’t work for UBS, and have the custody account in the name (or shared) with my spouse.
Certainly, _my_ employement contract with UBS does not have clauses for where my spouse does their banking and trading.
- If above does not work, I would try to get an exception included in the contract, or, if already employed, would circle with the bank’s compliance department and ask for an exemption to be granted. State upfront that you are willing to provide the information necessary for regulatory compliance to be fulfilled.
Even compliance people can be reasonable. You might have to sign additional terms & conditions (just click through, as always … ;-)) and provide them with yearly trading statements from your ~~better~~ other broker, but keep in mind it’s not an unreasonable thing to ask for an exception.
Remember, the bank only wants to (a) Cover Their Ass and (b) optimize (costs) for ensuring compliance imposed onto them by regulators. The simplest way is to demand that employees trade only at the bank.\*\* Now the bank can automate things, much cheaper than asking 112’842 employees to send in their trading journal and have that evaluated by a bunch of humans that you have to pay.
If just a bunch of employees ask for an exception, they may allow for it, as they probably already have a few edge cases where things need to be checked manually.
Only after being _denied_ an exception, you could try to go to court against your employer, as you were being reasonable, willing to provide them with the data necessary for them to carry out their compliance duties, and they didn’t play along, being unreasonable … but I admit, hauling your employer into court may be a tall order.
Maybe, if they don’t grant you an exception, re-apply and ask whether there’s anyone else with an exception and whether the employer’s course of action is cleared with the [Bankingombudsman](https://bankingombudsman.ch/) … you’re an employee, but as a forced customer of UBS you’re also a customer, and you can ask the banking ombudsman questions. They might even have better (and tested) answers than the ones provided here.
- You could of course always … oh, wait, @Helix stated in the OP to not go to the Dark Side, so I’ll refrain from discussing other options …
* * *
\* Not a lawyer yadda yadda ya.
\*\* Ok, it’s a nice side benefit for the bank that this boss move generates additional fees, minted of the bank’s own employees, but I would stipulate that’s not their main goal.
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### Author:  [@SwissDan](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/SwissDan)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 3:41pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/35 "2024-12-05T15:41:27Z")
This whole discussion is rather pointless. Either you accept your contract or you don’t.
Why work for UBS in the first place if you don’t agree with their terms?
This is not slavery, you are free to work for who you want.
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### Author:  [@anon17469660](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/anon17469660)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 3:44pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/36 "2024-12-05T15:44:31Z")
> [@SwissDan](#):
>
> This whole discussion is rather pointless.
Thanks for your heroic participation in the pointless discussion, then … 😉
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### Author:  [@Gesk](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Gesk)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 5:03pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/37 "2024-12-05T17:03:24Z")
Maybe you could just simply ask them to compensate the difference in brokerage costs in the salary and negotiate for a few 100s more per year…
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### Author:  [@Guillaume\_GVA](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Guillaume_GVA)
#### Post date: [December 5, 2024, 9:10pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/38 "2024-12-05T21:10:49Z")
I totally agree 👍
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### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2024, 10:51am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/39 "2024-12-06T10:51:20Z")
While I agree that it sucks that UBS is forcing you to use their own accounts/products with much higher fees, look at the bright side. Their pension fund is giving you 6-9%/year interest currently. I think that’s outweighing the downsides of investing with UBS.
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### Author:  [@Abs\_max](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Abs_max)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2024, 11:21am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/40 "2024-12-06T11:21:43Z")
6-9% interest in pension fund?
Wow.
If I work there I should just do voluntary buy ins and forget about everything else. Although I think this seems very high.
Maybe the employees can also submit a complain that it’s not same as market average and should be reduced to 1% - 2% because obviously this extra return is driven by higher cost product offering to rest of the world.
Just kidding 😉
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### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2024, 1:47pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/41 "2024-12-06T13:47:31Z")
UBS pension fund interest:
2021: 9.5%
2022: 7.0%
2023: 9.0%
2024-2026: 6-9% expected
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### Author:  [@Mirager](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Mirager)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2024, 2:43pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/42 "2024-12-06T14:43:09Z")
> [@Abs\_max](#):
>
> 6-9% interest in pension fund?
> Wow.
> If I work there I should just do voluntary buy ins and forget about everything else.
Bloody hell indeed, who wants the stock bullshit when you get this by your employer?
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### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2024, 2:51pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/43 "2024-12-06T14:51:30Z")
Risk free and no taxes on top 🙈
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### Author:  [@Mirager](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Mirager)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2024, 2:53pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/legality-of-requiring-employees-to-use-employing-companys-banking-services/9986/44 "2024-12-06T14:53:45Z")
So why you’re all whining like…because you can’t save pennies on “mustachian” “solutions” like IBKR?
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