# Finpension (2nd/3rd pillar investing)
**URL:** https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864
**Category:** Banks, Insurances & Third Pillar
**Created:** [December 6, 2019, 6:13am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864 "2019-12-06T06:13:51Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2019, 6:13am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/1 "2019-12-06T06:13:51Z")
The yield in pension funds is a joke, most of them will give you 1%/year. And you have to withdraw everything in 1 year and can’t split it up like the 3rd pillar.
Did anyone try to hide it? After changing jobs moving the 2nd pillar money to a Freizügigkeitskonto? If so, was the new pension fund insisting on the money?
I’ll probably change my job in May 2020. By then VIAC will offer the FZK solution. I think I’m going to try it and play stupid when the new pension fund is asking for my 2nd pillar money.
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### Author:  [@San\_Francisco](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/San_Francisco)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2019, 6:48am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/2 "2019-12-06T06:48:39Z")
It certainly happens. There are many vested benefits accounts which have accumulated multiple incoming payments from pension funds over years. Mostly due to lack of knowledge how the system works, though, than for optimization of tax and/or investment.
While there is an obligation to transfer to the new benefits scheme, enforcement, if any, is low.
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### Author:  [@Giff](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Giff)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2019, 12:33pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/3 "2019-12-06T12:33:58Z")
What’s the benefit of leaving part of the money in a Freizügigkeitskonto?
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### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2019, 12:34pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/4 "2019-12-06T12:34:45Z")
You can invest it and have a much higher yield.
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### Author:  [@dodelido](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/dodelido)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2019, 5:15pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/5 "2019-12-06T17:15:56Z")
Depending on your new job and the new employers 2nd pillar you might not even have to hide it, but can (at least partly) leave your money with VIAC completely legal.
In case you have more money in your 2nd pillar than you are allowed to bring to the new employer, then you have to park the rest on a Freizügigkeitskonto.
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### Author:  [@San\_Francisco](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/San_Francisco)
#### Post date: [December 6, 2019, 5:17pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/6 "2019-12-06T17:17:59Z")
> [@Cortana](#):
>
> higher yield
higher _expected_ yield.
You can invest it (differently) and _could_ have a much higher yield.
Though that is just _speculation_, really.
Mandatory occupational benefits in a pension fund are (in general) subject to a minimum „guaranteed“ rate of interest - which is _much_ higher than interest rates on any vested benefits account.
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### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2019, 7:48am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/7 "2019-12-24T07:48:14Z")
@nugget
I just checked my latest pension fund statement. Everything what’s related to insurances is just linked to the insured salary. So it really doesn’t matter how much is inside of it, it could be 5k or 300k.
So I’ll transfer it to VIAC as soon as I switch my job. This will make a huge difference longterm
Maybe I’ll split it up. 1/3 to new employer and 2/3 to VIAC. So nobody asks questions.
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### Author:  [@rolandinho](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/rolandinho)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2019, 9:58am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/8 "2019-12-24T09:58:44Z")
> [@Cortana](#):
>
> I’ll split it up. 1/3 to new employer and 2/3 to VIAC. So nobody
How are u going to do that? Afaik one’s previous PK will only transfer to one place.
Sorry, u are right @Cortana
"SR \*\*[220]
Art 12
1 Die Austrittsleistung darf von der bisherigen Vorsorgeeinrichtung höchstens an zwei Freizügigkeitseinrichtungen übertragen werden.
2 Die Versicherten können jederzeit die Freizügigkeitseinrichtung oder die Form der Erhaltung des Vorsorgeschutzes wechseln."
I’m not sure how free you are on deciding how to split. Any source on that?
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### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2019, 10:45am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/9 "2019-12-24T10:45:57Z")
I don’t know. I will find out in a couple of months and let you know 😃
But I’ll keep it in cash in VIAC till I’m sure the new pension fund isn’r requesting for additional funds.
What about this idea: I transfer almost everything to VIAC and tell them that I withdrawed it for buying property? Will they investigate or request documents for confirmation?
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### Author:  [@xorfish](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/xorfish)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2019, 11:00am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/10 "2019-12-24T11:00:47Z")
If you buy property with 2. pillar money, it will still be part of the 2. pillar and you have to return it once you sell the property. Pretty sure that you have to proof that you’ll use it to buy property.
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### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2019, 11:14am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/11 "2019-12-24T11:14:09Z")
I’m not talking about actually withdrawing. Just tell the new pension fund that I did it with the previous pension fund. So that they don’t ask for it.
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### Author:  [@San\_Francisco](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/San_Francisco)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2019, 12:21pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/12 "2019-12-24T12:21:22Z")
> [@Cortana](#):
>
> Just tell the new pension fund that I did it with the previous pension fund. So that they don’t ask for it.
They might request documentation from the previous pension fund, cause this data is supposed to be transmitted from old to new pension fund. In addition, it would constitute outright lying . as opposed to mere negligence.
Just split between to vested benefits accounts. You could then transfer one of them to the new pension fund again.
The whole thing has so far been loosely enforced anyway.
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### Author:  [@nugget](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/nugget)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2019, 4:06pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/13 "2019-12-24T16:06:22Z")
from experience i can tell it is no problem when you quit a job to tell the former pension fund to
“please transfer xx% to my Freizügigkeitskonto A and (100-xx)% to my Freizügigkeitskonto B”
no questions whatsoever were asked. everything went super smooth. took some weeks of time, though.
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### Author:  [@San\_Francisco](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/San_Francisco)
#### Post date: [December 24, 2019, 7:07pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/14 "2019-12-24T19:07:57Z")
You probably wouldn’t even have to split.
Some companies or their pension funds will actively request benefits from another institutions or take the effort to bother the insured person. Most shouldn’t be bothering you much if any about it, if you just stay mum.
> [@Cortana](#):
>
> tell them that I withdrawed it for buying property?
Side note: I think of all the possible “lies” about where your benefits went, this is actually the _most probable_ to make them investigate or request documents.
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### Author:  [@thc](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/thc)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2020, 5:20am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/15 "2020-01-22T05:20:28Z")
@Cortana, I like your thinking.
I’ve never done it myself, but from what I’ve heard from others, the easiest is to play dumb and forget about some 2nd pillar money from past employers. Most 2nd pillar fund administrators don’t follow the due diligence to gather all past money (required by law), so you should be good by “forgetting”.
And even if you get caught, well, it was just a forgetful moment while you had so many other things to think about while changing job…
By the way, VIAC Freizügigkeitskonto / Libre passage is soon to be deployed. A short email last week by VIAC support told me they will announce it officially in March 2020.
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### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2020, 5:24am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/16 "2020-01-22T05:24:25Z")
Thanks for the info, right in time! Will accept the new job offer today and start in May 2020. Till then I’ll have around 17k in my pension fund. I’ll probably leave 12k in Viac and send the other 5k to my new employers pension fund, so that they won’t ask any questions.
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### Author:  [@babyjag](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/babyjag)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2020, 6:06am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/17 "2020-01-22T06:06:21Z")
Thanks @Cortana for sharing your situation, and for all inputs in this thread
I am planning to do the same, the only difference is that I want to quit my job this year and take some well-deserved time off before looking for a new job
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### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2020, 6:34am UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/18 "2020-01-22T06:34:01Z")
Will give an update later this year how it went.
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### Author:  [@xerox5003](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/xerox5003)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2020, 12:41pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/19 "2020-01-22T12:41:23Z")
I am changing the job as well 🙂
Not sure, if I will “forget” the second pillar from the previous employer in my bank account (goal: transfer that to VIAC, as soon as it’s available) or transfering a part to my new employer (e.g. 50%, to make it not too obvious).
Probably, I’ll go with option 2. Keep you updated 🙂
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### Author:  [@Cortana](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/u/Cortana)
#### Post date: [January 22, 2020, 1:46pm UTC](https://forum.mustachianpost.com/t/finpension-2nd-3rd-pillar-investing/2864/20 "2020-01-22T13:46:50Z")
It might be the best solution. If you don’t transfer anything they will ask for sure.
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