Sounds crazy, but it’s just not the whole truth though. (At least in the Canton that I know)
The full price is only paid by “high earner families”, from about >150k family income (1child) or >180k (2children), so in the latter case paying 60k still leaves 120k income.
And surprise… Low earners (say 120k) would pay less than 1k per child per month, much less than “5000 minimum”.
I think it’s ok that if a couple earns >180k p.a. and have 2 children, they can pay 60k p.a. for a few years if both want to work. It’s their choice, no-one forces them. IMO that is fair to everyone.
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As far as I remember in order to get subsidized in Zurich city, the max income shall have been 110k for 1 kid (?) It may have changed in the meantime. I think only really low incomes get not much to pay, subventions are gradual.
Agree that for high incomes it is ok to pay the full price. I am not talking nor complaining about our own situation - I know we are lucky. Just surprized that a lot consider such high costs as fair for the whole society ; Switzerland has by far the highest costs in Europe (the calculation is obviously offseting the standard of living)
ps: A friend living in Zurich paid 3300 for her young kid who is around 3 years old before changing to a cheaper one
These things are like slippery slope or downwards spiral. It gets bigger and bigger over time. Then taxes would go up and salaries would go down. In the end you’ll become a bit like Germany and since Switzerland is smaller, it would lose its competitive advantage. Eventually people would move back to their countries or migrate to other countries and produce GDP there instead of here. Hence Switzerland would become poorer.
And for those who value it, it would become less economically and financially free. I’d prefer to have smaller state support rather than to turn Switzerland into another Germany, Italy or France (À Dieu ne plaise!).
For me personally, lean government is the main reason why I moved to Switzerland instead of any other European country in the first place. Good salary is a plus, but freedom and control over my life and money for me comes first (that’s why I would never move to a Scandinavian country, even if the daycare was free and the salaries were twice as big as here). Some people call it selfishness, I call it desire to be free, independent and responsible for myself and my family. I call it respect for other people’s work, entrepreneurship and property.
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The only time I have had this discussion is with people who have a good income though, and I do also have various income or single mum friends.
For example, I have friends with 2 small children, both work fulltime in very specialised branches and functions. Of course they “have” to work to keep their know-how, I understand that, but they never whine about not being able to spend more time with their children, but about how much the Kita costs (60k p.a.).
I reckon they must earn at least 300k p.a. together. C’mon, if you can’t pay market price, then who?
Sometimes the “much lower” Kita costs in Germany are thrown into the discussion. They never want to hear about the income taxes that they would be paying in Germany though. 
PS just to say, I’m not just “another no-kids person” judging parents, I would currently be paying 3k per month for a full-time Kita place for 1, but through generous employers we are not working 100% and baby only has to go 2 days a week, so it’s only 1.2k a month (40%). The loss of income hurts a bit, yes, but it’s only a few years, and we doing it for ourselves, not really for the Vaterland.
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I share the same opinion, it is OK that people with a comfy income pay the full price. If you read my post (again), you will read that I am not complaining about my own situation, I know we are priviledged. I was more thinking about people with lower income, where I believe it is unfair.
I just want to draw the attention that childcare costs are unfairly high in Switzerland.
I admit that there are many good things here and that overall I am happy here, otherwise we would leave.
Again, childcare costs are 2000-2500 per month until your kid goes to school when 6-7 years
old (Kindergarten = 3 hours in the morning during the 1st year, add 2 hours during 2 afternoons per week during the second Kindergarten year - you need to cover lunch, afternoon and holidays)
Then the costs are between 1200-1500 in public school until the kid is relatively independant (12-13 years). The school schedule is not 9-5.
These are the average monthly costs when both parents work in a 9-5 job, without relatives who could support from time to time, in Zurich area where salaries are higher compared to the rest of the country.
12-13 years at 2k/month per kid in average are not “few years” for me.
Decision you will make is simple. Will you both work or will somebody stay at home. Because it is not just for a couple of years when the kids are small. Once the school starts, they come home for lunch, school ends maybe a 3.30pm. So if you can’t find a part time agreement with you employer, somebody will stay home an be “Mum” or “Dad” and the other will focus his/her career.
That’s my main motivation behind FIRE. I want my son to have both mum and dad at home.
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By the way, I just had a thought how it was in my case. I grew up in Poland, I went to school at the age of 7, I guess right from the start I used to walk to school on my own, since I had only 1 km distance. After school I would walk to grandma, who lived nearby and was retired by 60 y.o. My parents would pick me up in the evening. I guess when I was 10, I would already get the key to the flat and walk back home and watch TV until parents came home. I remember being home at 13 and watching cartoons until 16 
.
I wonder why nowadays people rarely have the option to let grandparents look after the kid, and then teach the kid responsibility, so that he can take care of himself as soon as possible.
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Maybe people move more and the grandparents are more often in another city / country / continent.
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No, both can work 100% in good-paying jobs (if that is what they want) and pay for after-school care, Tagesmutter etc.
It’s 60k for a few years (+/- 5) then decreases a lot.
How do the working single mums do it?
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I was not directly referring to your situation, I understood that you are ok with your situation (expensive daycare but good enough income to pay).
You “speak up” for the lower income group though, inferring that they will have problems to pay such expensive day-care.
In my experience I have only heard high-income parents complaining, and never lower income parents. This I find strange, and leads me to believe that the “poor people” are subsidised to a level that is payable & acceptable to them. For example I have a single mum friend who is a secretary & gets no support from father & brings her small child to a Tagesmutter 100% & never heard a mention from her about expensive. But actually I will ask directly when I see her next.
Could it be that you are personally not OK with the expensive day-care, but it sounds better if communicated in a “but what about low-income people” way? Sorry if it sounds provocative, it’s really only meant as a discussion.
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We were lucky with a Tagesmutter and pay not much per day. We both work 80%, so we only need three days of childcare. If we would have used the daycare in the next village (we live far away from any bigger Swiss cities) it would have been 125 CHF per day.
For those interested: Subsidies are calculated according to the following table (where I live):
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I really am conscious and thankful to be privileged and do absolutely not complain about my own situation.
The post was about how much kids cost and the impact on FI, and my opinion is that the childcare system is unfair compared to other European countries, especially for the middle-class. As there are a lot of foreigners on this forum, I wanted to make a point that not only the costs are high, but you have to bear high costs until the kid is a teenager (unless your family is supporting you). I know a lot of my foreigner friends do not realize this until the kid goes to school.
I do really care about how lower incomes deal with it, as I have a lot of friends who just can’t afford to pay 2000-2500 CHF per kid and per month - or less, depending on the subsidies they would get. Some of them get in real shitty situations when they divorce / husband gets sick / husband dies after years of not working (whether willingly, or not willingly).
That kind of situation rings a bell with my own family history, which outcome is not brilliant at all.
Maybe you never heard people complaining about that because they believe “it is as it is and we cannot do anything to change this short-term”. Or just because they do not want to share that with you or anyone for whatever reason that belongs to them. What makes me sad is that the whole system is made to keep low(er) incomes in a couple (so: women) at home, no matter if it is their choice or not. I think it is a big loss for the whole society.
If you want to help your single mum friend, you would probably make her happy by babysitting her kid for few hours 
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If only wanting a good-paying job would be enough to get one! I am lucky to have one such job, but someone with a different education (or born in a lower income family, or whatever other random reason) would never land such a good paying job, not matter how much they wanted it.
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Agree. But it’s a long thread and you picking out one sentence, so missing out on most of the context.