I have the same situation, living in canton ZH with just bare ownership of properties in Italy. I understand I don’t need to declare in my income statement, can I still deduct the 20% flat maintenance cost (I guess no following the same principle). Regarding the net worth taxes do I need to declare anything? Moreover how is the value considered, do I need someone to make an official estimation?
In my case, I declared it the first time (VD) along with the notary papers because I did not know.
The final taxation decision had a “please stop declaring it, you should’t have declared it” note.
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I see
What I meant was is notary paper really needed or simply the fact that you don’t claim income from the property is enough of a justification to not declare it
So to conclude -
Not even the mention of it is needed in the tax filing (which would result in “satzbestimmend”, but not “steuerbar”)?
If I do put the value in,
and tick the box “Nutzniessung” (in ZHprivatetax),
it is still used as “satzbestimmend”. 
Why is there even the checkbox option,
if it’s not supposed to be declared?
I think the tax people will handle the computation.
Nutzniessung is the usufruct part, you have the right to use and that part you have to declare ! The bare ownership (i.e. without right to use) you don’t need to declare but if you do regardless you can put a value of 0 and add a comment that you have bare ownership only thus the 0 value. As I wrote I just don’t declare anything to keep it simple, bare ownership is not taxable in CH.
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Oh that makes sense,
I assumed something along the lines. 
Thank you!
I think that’s because in the software there is ko way to differentiate between usufruct or not
BL steuer asked me to provide the “tax value” of the properties listed under my Greek tax declaration and explain why I record no income from them. The GR documents record the tax value and state that there is a usufructuary, born in 195x (ie, it’s not me!). The reason there’s no income recorded from them is because the usufructuary (ie, my mother) is living there herself so there’s no rent (and even if there was, I am not entitled to it). My accountant in CH said there’s nothing to worry about after I provide the translated documents from the GR tax agency because they are clear. Is there?
It’s interesting that BL had info about your Greek tax return.
I think you are good. But it depends why the case was flagged
Nah, nothing fishy, I’ve provided property abroad breakdown every year. GR and CH have bilateral information exchange for decades.
Edit: yes, this is what’s weird, that they asked the question this year while the inheritance/usufruct situation is basically unchanged for >20 years (been living here since 2021). In any case the CH accountant said I’m safe from imputed rental value and possibly from wealth tax.
Yes. As I read on this forum Usufruct situation doesn’t attract tax liability for bare owner
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They ask for the market value, not the tax value. They do ignore the tax value for my vacation home in Spain and did estimate a much higher value. It was more than twice the Spanish tax value (which is very low anyhow).
In this case you are fine, you owe no tax at all in Switzerland. Probably you don’t even have to declare it. It will not rise your tax determining rate anyhow.
Der Nutzniesser versteuert den Eigenmietwert als Einkommen und den Nettowert als Vermögen.
Nutzniessung und Wohnrecht | VZ VermögensZentrum
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Nope, unless googletranslate is wrong:
- Unterlagen zu den Liegenschaften in Griechenland, inkl. Steuer-oder Kaufwert (inkl. Ubersetzung auf Deutsch oder Englisch)
- Die Liegenschaften werden weder mit Mietzinseinnahmen noch mit Eigenmietwert deklariert. Bitte teilen Sie uns die Gründe hierfür mit.
What the accountant said, which makes logical sense for me, is that if you declare everything correctly the first time you “build a case” for yourself for the future and simplify things down the line, have fewer things to explain, and can avoid hassle and back and forth with the tax agency. Edit: that and the fact I am a big chicken to leave things to creative interpretation so go full transparency by default!
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If you only have bare ownership you do not have to declare anything in the first place, or with a 0 value adding a comment that you only have bare ownership. The AEI does not cover properties but only bank accounts abroad so unless you declared the property the CH taxman would not have known about it. Did your accountant declare it or was that you ?
Actually I don t understand the comment of your account, there is no case to be built here: the property becomes tax relevant in CH as soon as all the persons having usufruct of the property are dead and then you can just write that this is part of you inheritance in the tax declaration of the year when you become the actual owner.
Sorry, of course they did ask for the tax value. But I think they mean the Swiss tax value which in theory is 80% of market or buying value if bought in the last decade. The Spanish tax value is calculated from size of the real estate and is very low and the Swiss tax authorities did not care about it.
But anyhow, you are fine. You are not even obliged to declare that. Explain the thing with usufructo and that should do it. Apparently you did declare the value but not the imputed rental and they want either nothing or both. In your case it is nothing…
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I did declare the properties myself.
The point about the “case” is just precaution, may be nothing but the way I understood it is eg if a person did become an owner, then sold, then suddenly many hundreds of thousands or more appeared in their Swiss account there could be questions, for which the answer could be “that property I was declaring as inheritor for 15 years got sold”, ie less hassle. May be nothing though and the accountant had enough of Greeks trying out funny stuff, hence said “just declare everything and we figure it out as and when needed”.
Hmmm apparently what’s on the GR doc is fine, besides, they also suggest the purchase price, that’d be fun, in 1980 drachmas 
Edit: what sense does Swiss tax/market value make? In my opinion none at all, you could buy a toilet in Zurich or London for the same amount you would buy a villa in rural Spain or Greece, or a village in Bosnia, for instance.
Edit: anyway appears all is fine once I give them the translated doc they want.
Not really a problem.
Mine was in 1991 Pesetas. That translated to Euros and then to CHF is close to nothing…
But as I said, the buying price is only relevant for real estate bought in the last decade.
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What about a plot/land in Eastern Europe with nothing on it? I bought it in 2023 and havent declared it so far. I don‘t even know how to get the property value.
Not a good idea risking a fine and a criminal record for almost nothing. Maybe you are still in time if the declaration of 2023 is not definitive yet.
The price to declare is your buying price minus 20% in most Kantons.
If your declaration was stamped “definitive” already you still have the amnesty program which you can use once in a lifetime in Switzerland. You will pay only the additional tax and interest (which may be cents in your case) and no prosecution.
The land will not be taxed in Switzerland but will rise the tax-defining assets and probably income.
Some municipalities show the actual state of your tax situation in “egovbox.ch”, otherwise just call them. Ask only for definitive or not, as the amnesty is only possible if the taxman still does not know about the goods to declare.